1 00:00:00,000 --> 00:00:18,440 Okay. So, on that basis we'll move to questions from the members. And as you know colleagues, you have 10 minutes each. 10 minutes for your questions and your answers. So just be mindful of that, how you want to use those 10 minutes. 2 00:00:19,380 --> 00:00:35,380 Just thank you both for coming today. As I said at the very beginning, it is voluntary. We do appreciate that. I'm sure you as well as everybody in this room realise the importance of all of this around our public service, Broadcaster RTE and its continuation into the future. So thank you very much because... 3 00:00:35,380 --> 00:00:46,560 I'd like to reiterate something I said earlier on, which is, we both want to say how much we respect the ROTUS as an institution, but also the work of your committee. So we're very happy to be here. 4 00:00:46,560 --> 00:00:53,560 Thank you very much. So without further ado, I'll turn to my colleagues and I'll ask Deputy Chris O'Sullivan to take the floor. 5 00:00:53,560 --> 00:01:15,740 Thank you very much. Thank you. This is also for attending, for only three hours, Camp Easy. Certainly wouldn't like to be in your shoes at this point, but for a play for offering to come in and try to clarify a lot of the issues I've raised over the past three weeks, I think that's commendable. 6 00:01:15,740 --> 00:01:22,740 That said, what the PAC session has done has posed further questions. 7 00:01:22,740 --> 00:01:52,720 Mr. Kelly, I want to focus on the raising of those two 75,000 euro invoices. The fact that clearly they were raised with the description of consultancy fees. Now, I think it's fair to say that I doubt anybody looking in at the previous session when we see that it was raised for consultancy fees, clearly which it wasn't for. When we see that these particular invoices were raised under CMS as opposed to the current 8 00:01:52,720 --> 00:02:15,720 NK, which would be unusual, people are incredibly skeptical, people are very questioning, people have serious doubts as to whether you didn't knowingly conceal these payments and you didn't work with RT in knowingly concealing the fact that these payments were coming from RT. Can you respond to that? Because that is the mood out there. 9 00:02:15,720 --> 00:02:33,720 Thank you for having us here. In addition to that, were there deceptive practices on the last of RT? There were. He's back. And we were deceived as well as we said earlier on. We had no knowledge whatsoever of the arrangement. And no part of it. 10 00:02:33,720 --> 00:02:40,720 But you knew they were for consultancy fees and they weren't actually consultancy. It wasn't for consultancy. That's the doubt that everybody has. 11 00:02:40,720 --> 00:02:50,720 So we were instructed by RTE, instructed by RTE for the second and third invoice of the Rena Roadshow to make those invoices out to Astus for consultancy services. He's back again in the background, look. 12 00:02:50,720 --> 00:02:59,720 And that they would look after them from there. At that time, we didn't know who Astus was, but we presumed that it was the relation of Rena. 13 00:02:59,720 --> 00:03:05,720 Can you understand why people are skeptical? Can you understand why people have concerns? The fact that it was consultancy fees was the description. 14 00:03:05,720 --> 00:03:07,720 I can, but they're the facts. 15 00:03:07,720 --> 00:03:18,720 You said earlier that you were just following a process. Are you aware of any process either in corporate governance or accounting that allows for an invoice to be raised with a description that it's not actually for? 16 00:03:18,720 --> 00:03:23,720 Well, I think again, we were, we were, um, it was what we were asked to do. 17 00:03:23,720 --> 00:03:29,720 The booking of Baghdad. Thank you very much. And Andy the fork and Jenny Bomb Benny. 18 00:03:29,720 --> 00:03:45,720 But that's a serious. Thank you very much. No, no, no, but you'd have to, you have to appreciate that if somebody says invoice, can you invoice that? That, you know, apparently these, I have it on good authority here from people who are in the note that this issue is going to be a bit more of a grill session than the last one. 19 00:03:45,720 --> 00:03:51,720 So it's going to be a proper barbecue. And broadcasting broadcast or yeah. Okay. Never. 20 00:03:51,720 --> 00:03:56,720 I know what I do. I mean, I don't know how anyone else chooses to describe my job, but I know what I do. 21 00:03:56,720 --> 00:03:58,720 I don't know how anyone else chooses to describe my job, but I know what I do. 22 00:03:58,720 --> 00:04:03,720 You, you, you've never partaken in consultancy. You don't do consultancy as a profession. You're, you're, you're a broadcaster. 23 00:04:03,720 --> 00:04:08,720 No, I don't know what the dictionary definition of consultancy is. I'm not being smart, but I, but I suspect- 24 00:04:08,720 --> 00:04:09,720 I'm not being smart. 25 00:04:09,720 --> 00:04:12,720 Okay. So that comes back to Mr. Kelly's- 26 00:04:12,720 --> 00:04:16,720 No, I mean, I don't know how anyone else chooses to describe my job, but I know what I do. 27 00:04:16,720 --> 00:04:19,720 You, you, you've, you've never partaken in consultancy. You don't- 28 00:04:19,720 --> 00:04:22,720 I know what I do and I do what I know. 29 00:04:22,720 --> 00:04:24,720 Do consultancy as a profession, you're, you're, you're a broadcaster. 30 00:04:24,720 --> 00:04:28,720 No, I don't know what the dictionary definition of consultancy is. I'm not being smart, but I- 31 00:04:28,720 --> 00:04:30,720 On the invoice. Yeah. 32 00:04:30,720 --> 00:04:36,720 You know, you're not a consultant. I'm sure Mr. Kelly knows that you're, you're, you're not providing consultancy in any way, shape or form. 33 00:04:36,720 --> 00:04:47,720 I mean, I suppose what I'm trying to get at here is, do you still have full trust, faith in Mr. Kelly, considering that it, it seems to be clear to everybody that there was some form of deception here. 34 00:04:47,720 --> 00:04:53,720 In, with RT and Mr. Kelly, using the term consultancy fees and also using a separate company that had never been used before. 35 00:04:53,720 --> 00:04:54,720 Yes. 36 00:04:54,720 --> 00:04:55,720 Do you still have full faith? 37 00:04:55,720 --> 00:05:05,720 I do have full faith. Yes, I do. And I think that he was doing his job. And in the course of his job, he was given instructions. And of course, the instructions, he carried them out. 38 00:05:05,720 --> 00:05:12,720 And you're happy that those instructions were to raise the invoice for consultancy fees. And he just went and did that without asking any questions. 39 00:05:12,720 --> 00:05:33,720 We would never have discussed that. I think that I would, if I was to look at so many of the things that I've been hearing at the various, you know, hearing, or act as hearings in the last two weeks, there's a lot of room for better practice around the place. And I suspect that as on Monday with the new director general, that's going to happen. 40 00:05:33,720 --> 00:05:40,720 I've got the merch. I think in some ways this is cathartic. Not quite the question. 41 00:05:40,720 --> 00:05:41,720 Not quite the question. 42 00:05:41,720 --> 00:05:53,720 The Noel Kelly NK Ultra merch has just dropped. And I've got it right here, guys. I'm getting really into the vibe, to the spirit of the proceedings. I hope you are as well. 43 00:05:53,720 --> 00:05:59,720 They came from CMS, which was different to how they would usually come from. I mean, there's a lot of doubts there among the public. 44 00:05:59,720 --> 00:06:00,720 Yeah. 45 00:06:00,720 --> 00:06:12,720 You knowing that now, and all of that being brought up today at today's PAC, can you still honestly say, despite, you know, the public sentiment out there that you still have full faith and that you continue to let Mr. Kelly work? 46 00:06:12,720 --> 00:06:13,720 Yes, I agree. 47 00:06:13,720 --> 00:06:16,720 Where is Dead Space Stream? It's in the pipeline. 48 00:06:16,720 --> 00:06:20,720 I can only thank you very much for holding on. 49 00:06:20,720 --> 00:06:21,720 I can only thank you very much for holding on. 50 00:06:21,720 --> 00:06:22,720 I can only thank you very much for holding on. 51 00:06:22,720 --> 00:06:23,720 Thank you. 52 00:06:23,720 --> 00:06:28,720 He was asked, would he work with agents like Mr. Kelly again? 53 00:06:28,720 --> 00:06:31,720 He was asked, would this be a yes or no answer? 54 00:06:31,720 --> 00:06:33,720 He said, not a definite, yes, not a definite. 55 00:06:33,720 --> 00:06:37,720 In association with NK Ultra Enterprises. 56 00:06:37,720 --> 00:06:40,720 Does that not put your future at RTE in serious jeopardy? 57 00:06:40,720 --> 00:06:47,720 No, no, it doesn't. I mean, I can still work with Noel and negotiate an agreement with RTE, you know, it's different jobs. 58 00:06:47,720 --> 00:06:50,720 Now, RTE is one element of what I do for a living. 59 00:06:50,720 --> 00:06:55,720 So potentially any future arrangement you have with RTE would exclude NK services. 60 00:06:55,720 --> 00:06:56,720 What would you say to that? 61 00:06:56,720 --> 00:06:57,720 What would you say, Noel? 62 00:06:57,720 --> 00:06:59,720 Sorry, if I could ask. 63 00:06:59,720 --> 00:07:02,720 Ooh, not necessarily, he says, disagreeing with Ryan. 64 00:07:02,720 --> 00:07:05,720 Sir, just to add to that, we manage a number of people. 65 00:07:05,720 --> 00:07:09,720 A lot of them don't have enough, like most of them are not full time broadcasters. 66 00:07:09,720 --> 00:07:11,720 They bits and pieces of work. 67 00:07:11,720 --> 00:07:12,720 I represent them. 68 00:07:12,720 --> 00:07:14,720 I'm like, I am their shop. 69 00:07:14,720 --> 00:07:15,720 I'm their shop steward. 70 00:07:15,720 --> 00:07:16,720 I'm their union. 71 00:07:16,720 --> 00:07:18,720 I'm the only thing between them and absolutely nothing. 72 00:07:18,720 --> 00:07:19,720 So, you have to get this right. 73 00:07:19,720 --> 00:07:22,720 So, are you saying to me that a director... 74 00:07:22,720 --> 00:07:28,720 Did he say, I'm the thing that between them and absolutely nothing. 75 00:07:28,720 --> 00:07:29,720 Did he say that? 76 00:07:29,720 --> 00:07:31,720 Like as in, they'd be nothing without me. 77 00:07:31,720 --> 00:07:34,720 General would say, I read them, but that these people could be... 78 00:07:34,720 --> 00:07:36,720 that these people can't have representation. 79 00:07:36,720 --> 00:07:40,720 They don't have enough, like most of them are not full time broadcasters of what I do for a living. 80 00:07:40,720 --> 00:07:45,720 So, potentially any future arrangement you have with RT would exclude an old services. 81 00:07:45,720 --> 00:07:46,720 What would you say to that? 82 00:07:46,720 --> 00:07:47,720 No. 83 00:07:47,720 --> 00:07:48,720 What would you say? 84 00:07:48,720 --> 00:07:51,720 Sorry, if I could add to that. 85 00:07:51,720 --> 00:07:53,720 We manage a number of people. 86 00:07:53,720 --> 00:07:57,720 A lot of them don't have enough, like most of them are not full time broadcasters. 87 00:07:57,720 --> 00:07:59,720 They bits and pieces of work. 88 00:07:59,720 --> 00:08:00,720 I represent them. 89 00:08:00,720 --> 00:08:01,720 I'm like, I am their shop. 90 00:08:01,720 --> 00:08:02,720 I'm their shop steward. 91 00:08:02,720 --> 00:08:03,720 I'm their union. 92 00:08:03,720 --> 00:08:05,720 I'm the only thing between them and absolutely nothing. 93 00:08:05,720 --> 00:08:07,720 So, you have to get this right. 94 00:08:07,720 --> 00:08:08,720 So, you said... 95 00:08:08,720 --> 00:08:10,720 I thought he was saying, I'm their shopkeeper. 96 00:08:10,720 --> 00:08:11,720 Same to me. 97 00:08:11,720 --> 00:08:13,720 He is their God. 98 00:08:13,720 --> 00:08:14,720 I think that the director general would say... 99 00:08:14,720 --> 00:08:16,720 Did you hear the DG's comments yesterday? 100 00:08:16,720 --> 00:08:20,720 I read them, but these people can't have representation. 101 00:08:20,720 --> 00:08:21,720 They are not all the top three. 102 00:08:21,720 --> 00:08:24,720 What I got from those comments was, in all likelihood, you wouldn't be willing to work with you again. 103 00:08:24,720 --> 00:08:25,720 I mean... 104 00:08:25,720 --> 00:08:28,720 But I think it wasn't a flat note, but we will have to see. 105 00:08:28,720 --> 00:08:29,720 Okay. 106 00:08:30,720 --> 00:08:37,720 Just in relation to, again, the 150,000 euro, and just trying to get to the bottom of facts here and trying to establish things... 107 00:08:37,720 --> 00:08:38,720 Big, big, big money! 108 00:08:38,720 --> 00:08:46,720 When did the 150,000 euro for those two latter invoices, in particular, the 275,000 euro invoices, when did they go to... 109 00:08:46,720 --> 00:08:49,720 They would have gone to your account first, Mr Kelly? 110 00:08:49,720 --> 00:08:50,720 We would have invoiced them. 111 00:08:50,720 --> 00:08:55,720 We would have invoiced Astus, and then they were paid. 112 00:08:55,720 --> 00:08:56,720 Yeah. 113 00:08:56,720 --> 00:08:57,720 But those two invoices... 114 00:08:57,720 --> 00:08:59,720 So, the first invoice was paid by Renault. 115 00:08:59,720 --> 00:09:00,720 Yeah. 116 00:09:00,720 --> 00:09:01,720 And the second two invoices were paid... 117 00:09:01,720 --> 00:09:02,720 Together. 118 00:09:02,720 --> 00:09:03,720 By Astus. 119 00:09:03,720 --> 00:09:04,720 Sorry, if I could just... 120 00:09:04,720 --> 00:09:06,720 We're paid by Astus. 121 00:09:06,720 --> 00:09:07,720 More adapters. 122 00:09:07,720 --> 00:09:08,720 More touching. 123 00:09:08,720 --> 00:09:10,720 The first three events have happened. 124 00:09:10,720 --> 00:09:11,720 So, there... 125 00:09:11,720 --> 00:09:12,720 More sippage. 126 00:09:12,720 --> 00:09:15,720 Those two invoices are for the next six events that are still... 127 00:09:15,720 --> 00:09:17,720 Sorry there, there was a lovely... 128 00:09:17,720 --> 00:09:20,720 From Tubbs there, after he took a drink of that cup. 129 00:09:20,720 --> 00:09:21,720 Let's have a look at that again. 130 00:09:21,720 --> 00:09:22,720 So... 131 00:09:22,720 --> 00:09:24,720 Just wanted a kind of direct answer to the actual questions. 132 00:09:24,720 --> 00:09:25,720 When did the 150,000... 133 00:09:25,720 --> 00:09:28,720 Shag man, thank you very much, and Tom's bar for... 134 00:09:28,720 --> 00:09:30,720 For those latter two invoices, go into the... 135 00:09:30,720 --> 00:09:31,720 It would be the CMS account. 136 00:09:31,720 --> 00:09:32,720 Jerry Ryan, thank you. 137 00:09:32,720 --> 00:09:33,720 What would I... 138 00:09:33,720 --> 00:09:34,720 Got a second. 139 00:09:34,720 --> 00:09:36,720 Look at this. 140 00:09:36,720 --> 00:09:38,720 It's like a Blackboard Jungle. 141 00:09:38,720 --> 00:09:39,720 Confer. 142 00:09:39,720 --> 00:09:40,720 Sorry, we're just gonna confer here. 143 00:09:40,720 --> 00:09:41,720 What is it? 144 00:09:41,720 --> 00:09:42,720 What's going on? 145 00:09:42,720 --> 00:09:43,720 One of you might be able to answer this. 146 00:09:43,720 --> 00:09:45,720 When did they go then into the Tuttle account? 147 00:09:45,720 --> 00:09:47,720 I presume they would have gone from... 148 00:09:47,720 --> 00:09:50,720 The payment of 150 would then have gone from you into the Tuttle account. 149 00:09:50,720 --> 00:09:51,720 I don't have to. 150 00:09:51,720 --> 00:09:52,720 I would know... 151 00:09:52,720 --> 00:09:54,720 Could you find out that information? 152 00:09:54,720 --> 00:09:56,720 It would be in the 2022... 153 00:09:56,720 --> 00:09:57,720 In the 2022. 154 00:09:57,720 --> 00:09:58,720 Yeah. 155 00:09:58,720 --> 00:10:00,720 So it would have been prior to the publication of the... 156 00:10:00,720 --> 00:10:01,720 Top earners in... 157 00:10:01,720 --> 00:10:07,720 On the 15th of February, I think, in 2023. 158 00:10:07,720 --> 00:10:14,720 Basically, Mr. Tobri, I guess what I'm trying to get at here is that you would have seen this 150,000 Euro come into your account. 159 00:10:14,720 --> 00:10:19,720 You would have seen that then it wasn't represented in the payments in February 2023. 160 00:10:19,720 --> 00:10:22,720 I know you apologise for it before, but that... 161 00:10:22,720 --> 00:10:26,720 Sorry, sorry, the 2023 publications is only for 2020-21 earnings. 162 00:10:26,720 --> 00:10:27,720 So it wasn't... 163 00:10:27,720 --> 00:10:28,720 Do you know what I'm saying? 164 00:10:28,720 --> 00:10:31,720 The RT publication is only for 2020-21. 165 00:10:31,720 --> 00:10:34,720 Because generally they're three years... 166 00:10:34,720 --> 00:10:35,720 But the... 167 00:10:35,720 --> 00:10:36,720 Three years behind. 168 00:10:36,720 --> 00:10:40,720 And as I said this morning as well, we get ten minutes notice that these are going out. 169 00:10:40,720 --> 00:10:42,720 But the invoice is related to which years? 170 00:10:42,720 --> 00:10:45,720 The invoice is related to 2021-22. 171 00:10:45,720 --> 00:10:46,720 So part of the... 172 00:10:46,720 --> 00:10:47,720 Part of those 2022... 173 00:10:47,720 --> 00:10:52,720 Part of the earnings that were published in February 2023 would have been related to 2021 as well. 174 00:10:52,720 --> 00:10:53,720 Confir. 175 00:10:53,720 --> 00:10:55,720 There's still to be on, okay. 176 00:10:55,720 --> 00:11:01,720 I've got one minute left, so I'll just move on very quickly. 177 00:11:01,720 --> 00:11:09,720 Mr. Tobri, in July of 2020, you got a... 178 00:11:09,720 --> 00:11:14,720 A letter addressed to you from the then DG, D Forbes. 179 00:11:14,720 --> 00:11:19,720 Basically stating the purpose of this correspondence is to record and write in our guarantee and our undertaking... 180 00:11:19,720 --> 00:11:22,720 It's a great beard he's got. 181 00:11:22,720 --> 00:11:25,720 He's cultivated a really rich shag pile. 182 00:11:25,720 --> 00:11:27,720 It's dense. 183 00:11:27,720 --> 00:11:28,720 It's thick. 184 00:11:28,720 --> 00:11:30,720 It's not unkempt. 185 00:11:30,720 --> 00:11:31,720 It's well trimmed. 186 00:11:31,720 --> 00:11:35,720 It's a well trimmed beard. 187 00:11:35,720 --> 00:11:41,720 So essentially it's a letter saying that you will get no further reduction fees or reduction in earnings. 188 00:11:41,720 --> 00:11:43,720 How does that sit with you? 189 00:11:43,720 --> 00:11:50,720 Knowing that colleagues around you were taking pay cuts left, right and centre... 190 00:11:50,720 --> 00:11:58,720 I'd say it's a salt and pepper look he's going for, but it's more of a salt and rainbow peppercorn because of the kind of brownish... 191 00:11:58,720 --> 00:12:00,720 No, it's not black like it. 192 00:12:00,720 --> 00:12:03,720 It's kind of reddish as well. 193 00:12:03,720 --> 00:12:05,720 It's a rainbow peppercorn, salt and peppercorn. 194 00:12:05,720 --> 00:12:12,720 He's gone for the fucking Himalayan rock salt and rainbow peppercorn look, which is really working well for him. 195 00:12:12,720 --> 00:12:14,720 ...figure here in these conversations. 196 00:12:14,720 --> 00:12:19,720 I think what happens is, Deputy, is that some numbers have been isolated somewhat unfairly. 197 00:12:19,720 --> 00:12:25,720 And the truth of the matter is, I did take pay cuts and since 2012, I think, or more... 198 00:12:25,720 --> 00:12:27,720 For the six years, 2012 to 20. 199 00:12:27,720 --> 00:12:28,720 2012 to 20. 200 00:12:28,720 --> 00:12:31,720 It was a total sum of approximately 40%. 201 00:12:31,720 --> 00:12:36,720 You received a letter from the DG that no other staff or employee, to my knowledge, would have received. 202 00:12:36,720 --> 00:12:39,720 Does that not kind of scream special treatment? 203 00:12:39,720 --> 00:12:40,720 Can I answer that one? 204 00:12:40,720 --> 00:12:44,720 That was a request that was in the contract negotiations. 205 00:12:44,720 --> 00:12:52,720 And why it was, was because Ryan had taken 120,000 of this 3, 4, 5 was never invoiced for, never taken. 206 00:12:52,720 --> 00:12:55,720 Ryan had never invoiced it, so he decided not to take that payment. 207 00:12:55,720 --> 00:13:03,720 Then in the 20 contract, which is 20, 21 to 23, 34, he reduces his earnings voluntarily by 105,000. 208 00:13:03,720 --> 00:13:07,720 That was 525, plus the 120, which he didn't take. 209 00:13:07,720 --> 00:13:08,720 So overall from 12... 210 00:13:08,720 --> 00:13:09,720 That's not really what I'm asking. 211 00:13:09,720 --> 00:13:10,720 No, I know, but... 212 00:13:10,720 --> 00:13:12,720 Sorry, I am going to have to draw to the net. 213 00:13:12,720 --> 00:13:13,720 Okay, yeah, fair yet. 214 00:13:13,720 --> 00:13:14,720 He lost... 215 00:13:14,720 --> 00:13:15,720 Ooh! 216 00:13:15,720 --> 00:13:16,720 He lost it. 217 00:13:16,720 --> 00:13:18,720 He absolutely lost it there. 218 00:13:18,720 --> 00:13:20,720 Sorry about the hot mic there coming in. 219 00:13:20,720 --> 00:13:21,720 Hot... 220 00:13:22,720 --> 00:13:26,720 NK Ultra there with a blunder guff of an explanation. 221 00:13:28,720 --> 00:13:30,720 He's in the long grass. 222 00:13:30,720 --> 00:13:35,820 voices were coming for from rte they were underwritten by rte essentially coming from 223 00:13:35,820 --> 00:13:42,820 the license fee holder and the tax tax uh taxpayer and don't don't you fuck it up fucking hell 224 00:13:42,820 --> 00:13:49,680 unfortunately not this is one of the great kind of fog of war situations here where the money that 225 00:13:49,680 --> 00:13:54,840 came in enormous amount of money i don't deny it for a moment but it came from of course as we 226 00:13:54,840 --> 00:13:58,760 understood it from reno so we thought it was a side it was a totally different agreement entirely 227 00:13:58,760 --> 00:14:03,780 it was an independent contractor agreement that reno john and that that was what that was the 228 00:14:03,780 --> 00:14:09,260 understanding that's what i was told i had to drive the new reno tripod agreement you know how it worked 229 00:14:09,260 --> 00:14:14,840 it was an underwriting it was it was those two 75 000 euro invoices were underwritten by rt paid for 230 00:14:14,840 --> 00:14:22,400 by rt taxpayers um you know tv license holders to your account do you not accept that you actually 231 00:14:22,400 --> 00:14:28,740 haven't taken a 20 pay cut it it represents again again sorry i'm sorry we'll have to conclude okay 232 00:14:28,740 --> 00:14:35,280 and move on deputy oh come on thanks very much for your look and again i'd like to thank our guests 233 00:14:35,280 --> 00:14:42,600 uh for me again earlier session very constructive alan dylan give it to them so i'll start again go on 234 00:14:42,600 --> 00:14:50,240 from um deputy o'suldan's line of question rte previously stated that they they never made uh cash 235 00:14:50,240 --> 00:14:54,600 transactions to the barter system for presenters and this was particularly 236 00:14:54,600 --> 00:15:09,200 can i ask mr kelly have you ever made any cash payments to bartering system no and we've no 237 00:15:09,200 --> 00:15:14,460 knowledge of the arrangements we've no part in suggesting it or setting it up we were sorry we 238 00:15:14,460 --> 00:15:19,520 were not consulted about it we were told we weren't told of any at any stage i'd say the nature of it 239 00:15:19,520 --> 00:15:24,920 i don't i want to get as much information as possible and the tees only have 10 minutes okay 240 00:15:24,920 --> 00:15:31,000 so just allow him to ask the question sorry mr kelly why would you not do a cash transaction to a bartering 241 00:15:31,000 --> 00:15:37,060 system i'm sorry why would you not make a cash transaction through a barter system i'd never come 242 00:15:37,060 --> 00:15:43,200 across a barter system before this i i didn't i get that this was the list literally this was 243 00:15:43,200 --> 00:15:51,660 the first well we know earlier this morning that uh in 2018 you used astus for uh uh transaction 244 00:15:51,660 --> 00:15:57,800 through uh for your for your charity back in 2018 no no you had not no that was clarified this morning 245 00:15:57,800 --> 00:16:06,380 no no no no no no or no rte or took a table okay last year i've never come a barter higgy smalls i 246 00:16:06,380 --> 00:16:14,240 heard it i heard it not at all retracting sorry sorry okay so again statement retraction examined 247 00:16:14,240 --> 00:16:20,760 this morning rt raised an invoice with your company cms for payment by a third party company 248 00:16:20,760 --> 00:16:30,500 pastus who you didn't know yeah okay that rt had never previously dealt with thank you very much f u 249 00:16:30,500 --> 00:16:37,340 deputy stag shag man thank you very much and can you please tell will to get back to work and stop 250 00:16:37,340 --> 00:16:47,040 watching this madness will you heard it is that correct yes yeah yeah and as i said yeah yeah yeah 251 00:16:47,040 --> 00:16:50,780 it's not that it was and we presumed we presumed it was something that it was not that it was not that 252 00:16:50,780 --> 00:16:57,980 does that not sound bizarre to you a note on the invoice sent to geraldine o'leary from the commercial 253 00:16:57,980 --> 00:17:04,980 manager clearly stated don't put a person's name on the invoice did you ask that commercial manager to 254 00:17:04,980 --> 00:17:11,420 to do that he's on the ropes i can only i can only reiterate well we see the email that went to geraldine o'leary 255 00:17:11,420 --> 00:17:14,020 We, we, all I can say is, go on, go on Alan. 256 00:17:14,600 --> 00:17:16,580 Don't put any person's name on the invoice. 257 00:17:16,800 --> 00:17:17,480 Go on Alan. 258 00:17:17,720 --> 00:17:18,240 Did you instruct? 259 00:17:18,240 --> 00:17:18,520 Go on. 260 00:17:18,880 --> 00:17:20,080 No, they sent that to us. 261 00:17:21,720 --> 00:17:23,180 This was sent to Geraldine O'Leary. 262 00:17:23,400 --> 00:17:26,220 No, Geraldine O'Leary, they, Geraldine O'Leary sent it, sent it. 263 00:17:26,540 --> 00:17:29,220 Sorry, her person sent it to us, sorry. 264 00:17:29,480 --> 00:17:29,860 Yes. 265 00:17:30,320 --> 00:17:32,380 Did you instruct that person to not put a name on the invoice? 266 00:17:32,380 --> 00:17:33,220 Go on Alan, get him. 267 00:17:34,300 --> 00:17:36,620 No, we were just, again, acting on the instructions from RTE. 268 00:17:37,200 --> 00:17:38,200 Who instructed you? 269 00:17:38,640 --> 00:17:39,280 What's that look? 270 00:17:39,280 --> 00:17:40,480 What's he giving him there look? 271 00:17:40,480 --> 00:17:42,740 This email didn't come from Geraldine O'Leary. 272 00:17:43,080 --> 00:17:44,800 It went to Geraldine O'Leary. 273 00:17:45,700 --> 00:17:49,540 In it, in it, it said, if it said back, I will throw everything out. 274 00:17:49,620 --> 00:17:50,500 We took comfort from this. 275 00:17:51,660 --> 00:17:53,020 Sorry, sorry, Chair. 276 00:17:53,240 --> 00:17:53,640 Sorry, Chair. 277 00:17:54,300 --> 00:17:57,720 So what was done as per RTE's request and RTE's instructions? 278 00:17:57,940 --> 00:18:01,620 So, like, it just doesn't add up why RTE went to such lengths 279 00:18:01,620 --> 00:18:04,680 and obviously did themselves so much damage, 280 00:18:05,520 --> 00:18:07,780 not only to the taxpayer, but to their own reputation, 281 00:18:08,400 --> 00:18:10,240 to protect Mr. Tuberty's name. 282 00:18:11,220 --> 00:18:15,240 But this, Mr. Tuberty was doing events for Renault, not for RTE. 283 00:18:15,560 --> 00:18:16,400 So Renault's the sponsor. 284 00:18:16,460 --> 00:18:17,360 He's doing events for Renault. 285 00:18:17,480 --> 00:18:18,480 We were paid by Renault. 286 00:18:18,780 --> 00:18:21,280 We understood this money would be paid by Renault. 287 00:18:21,760 --> 00:18:24,980 And there's still two years of events owned for Renault. 288 00:18:24,980 --> 00:18:30,840 Can I ask, did Renault reduce its overall advertising bill with RTE to cover this separate contract? 289 00:18:30,840 --> 00:18:34,180 We, again, we have no relationship with Renault. 290 00:18:34,180 --> 00:18:35,900 So that's an RTE Renault. 291 00:18:37,220 --> 00:18:40,720 I'd have no knowledge of their advertising or sponsorship. 292 00:18:41,040 --> 00:18:43,180 We wouldn't be part of any of that. 293 00:18:43,540 --> 00:18:49,880 So you're not aware that Renault were going to divert existing advertising budgets for RTE to cover a new contract, 294 00:18:49,880 --> 00:18:54,700 or a separate contract that you were negotiating on behalf of Renault? 295 00:18:54,700 --> 00:18:55,340 No. 296 00:18:55,340 --> 00:18:55,840 No. 297 00:18:56,260 --> 00:18:56,880 Completely not. 298 00:18:57,200 --> 00:18:57,420 OK. 299 00:18:57,420 --> 00:19:04,360 So you're completely washing your hands off the deal, which you were going to be a sole beneficiary of. 300 00:19:04,940 --> 00:19:05,900 And so was Ryan. 301 00:19:07,180 --> 00:19:12,320 This deal was constructed by RTE with Renault for Renault. 302 00:19:14,180 --> 00:19:15,800 It's very difficult to accept that. 303 00:19:15,800 --> 00:19:18,800 And we were, we, we, it was a completely separate contract for services. 304 00:19:19,160 --> 00:19:25,440 Like Ryan, Ryan, his contract is for radio, 205 shows, TV, 38, 2 hour plus shows. 305 00:19:26,120 --> 00:19:28,820 Drive the new Ryan Tupperty, well, no. 306 00:19:30,680 --> 00:19:32,280 You were the sole beneficiary. 307 00:19:32,360 --> 00:19:33,680 You were going to get a commission fee on it. 308 00:19:34,040 --> 00:19:37,520 Ryan was going to get an extra top-up payment on top of his salary. 309 00:19:38,100 --> 00:19:40,780 So you're telling me that you were following the instructions by RTE. 310 00:19:40,780 --> 00:19:45,160 You haven't driven until you've driven the new Renault sequester. 311 00:19:46,520 --> 00:19:48,400 Sponsored by Sean Pellegrino. 312 00:19:48,400 --> 00:19:51,560 Under their instruction, as you can see, and that's why we've come here today. 313 00:19:51,640 --> 00:19:53,800 And that's why we've provided all of this documentation. 314 00:19:56,280 --> 00:20:03,700 The alleged method, you know, does suggest that you collaborated with RTE, as I said in the previous committee, 315 00:20:03,860 --> 00:20:06,420 to engage in the secret payment to the bartering system. 316 00:20:07,640 --> 00:20:08,740 I'm not RTE. 317 00:20:09,720 --> 00:20:10,860 I'm not RTE. 318 00:20:10,860 --> 00:20:11,440 There's a quote. 319 00:20:11,580 --> 00:20:12,400 That's a question for RTE. 320 00:20:12,400 --> 00:20:13,520 But you were the beneficiary. 321 00:20:14,400 --> 00:20:15,720 You were the beneficiary. 322 00:20:16,380 --> 00:20:16,820 Ooh. 323 00:20:17,220 --> 00:20:17,460 What? 324 00:20:17,720 --> 00:20:17,880 Okay? 325 00:20:18,300 --> 00:20:22,420 With the intention of hiring the payment for your agent. 326 00:20:22,560 --> 00:20:23,120 Is that correct? 327 00:20:23,700 --> 00:20:27,360 Dylan's fucking giving him the old one, two, three, four, five. 328 00:20:28,740 --> 00:20:30,800 Could you just repeat it one more time? 329 00:20:30,800 --> 00:20:31,040 Sorry. 330 00:20:31,600 --> 00:20:31,880 Ooh. 331 00:20:32,520 --> 00:20:34,320 He's a glutton for punishment, his ultra. 332 00:20:34,320 --> 00:20:39,120 The bartering system, which normally RTE would never do cash transactions. 333 00:20:39,720 --> 00:20:43,520 Was there an intention of hiding the payment made to your agent, Ryan Tuberley? 334 00:20:44,720 --> 00:20:52,620 We, again, we were instructed by RTE that all invoices for the Renner Roadshow go to Astus for the services as they had stated. 335 00:20:52,620 --> 00:21:09,260 So during an online meeting in May of 2020 between yourself, the former DG, RT's solicitor, and a colleague of yours, a verbal guarantee was given by RT to underwrite the Renault commercial agreement. 336 00:21:09,640 --> 00:21:10,160 Is that correct? 337 00:21:12,020 --> 00:21:15,360 Yeah, but previous to that, Brito Keith had... 338 00:21:15,360 --> 00:21:18,740 Tonight at nine on Primetime Investigates. 339 00:21:19,780 --> 00:21:27,220 In pay ultra Cadbury's Renault, the secret payments and the unknown mileage. 340 00:21:27,220 --> 00:21:57,200 From RTE and not Reynolds payment. That was going to be supporting these invoices. At every juncture we expect this is Renault. Reynolds were not in a position to renew the contract for the late NATO in 2020. Why weren't they? Was it not a case that. No Renault is still a sponsor. Still a sponsor but in terms of the tripartite agreement to underwrite these payments. No and again anything to do with sponsorship. 341 00:21:57,200 --> 00:22:05,440 Advertising. That's RTE and Renault. We have. Renault, Renault, Renault, Renault. Cut the crap Kelly. 342 00:22:05,960 --> 00:22:11,940 You played a pivotal role. Thanks very much there Gillian for the tip and Deputy Stag. 343 00:22:12,940 --> 00:22:20,800 I'm blaming it on RTE now at the minute. Seems, seems very difficult or credible for us to accept. 344 00:22:20,800 --> 00:22:38,180 Okay, well I would say to you Deputy that in an organisation that turns over 350... That's not the question I asked. That's not the question I asked. Can I answer please? No, no. Minister. Minister. Minister. Thanks to Mr Kennedy. I know but... You played a pivotal role in this. 345 00:22:39,280 --> 00:22:48,160 OTE under instruction every time I asked to do this. To the barter system for a cash transaction that didn't have Mr Tuberty's name on it. We didn't know what a barter system was until all of this happened. 346 00:22:48,580 --> 00:22:54,500 You're washing your hands of it. Completely. It's an OTE I think I'm going to. Completely. Mr Tuberty. Mama Duck. Thank you very much. 347 00:22:54,620 --> 00:22:56,160 In relation to the discrepancy. 348 00:22:57,220 --> 00:22:59,920 And what you were paid and what was published. 349 00:23:00,420 --> 00:23:01,140 Okay. Yeah. 350 00:23:01,880 --> 00:23:03,240 Why didn't you ask questions at the time? 351 00:23:05,960 --> 00:23:11,360 Sorry. Are you referring to the years 2017, 2019 and 2019? 352 00:23:13,180 --> 00:23:15,360 He's gone. He's wiped already. 353 00:23:15,360 --> 00:23:21,120 My remuneration and why I didn't object to it at the time. Am I right in saying that? 354 00:23:21,120 --> 00:23:21,160 Yeah. 355 00:23:22,160 --> 00:23:27,460 And we need to begin with the contract 2015 ran until 2020 just to be sure, to be certain. 356 00:23:28,620 --> 00:23:36,540 And it states clearly how much I was being paid every year of the five-year contract for hosting the two shows, Lay Late and the radio show. 357 00:23:36,600 --> 00:23:48,100 In addition to these sums, the contract states that I was to be paid a further sum of 120,000 euro in what has variously be called an exit fee or a loyalty bonus or what have you. 358 00:23:48,600 --> 00:23:50,440 And in reality, this was a fee to be paid. 359 00:23:50,440 --> 00:23:53,480 Really, really, Mr. V. You weren't aware of what you were being paid. 360 00:23:53,900 --> 00:24:00,740 I, in reality, this was a fee to be paid at the end of the contract where I would make myself available at any stage during the contract. 361 00:24:00,740 --> 00:24:03,220 Youth rich. Thank you very much. I'm past Kenny Greeno. 362 00:24:03,820 --> 00:24:12,880 Now, as it turned out, in 2020, when that contract concluded, I was not called upon to deliver any of these additional pieces of work. 363 00:24:12,880 --> 00:24:17,820 So although I was entitled to payment for making myself available, I waived this entitlement. 364 00:24:18,020 --> 00:24:23,100 I didn't issue any invoice on the basis that I didn't want to be paid for work that I did not do. 365 00:24:23,320 --> 00:24:25,340 Even though, even though, can I ask Mr. Kelly? 366 00:24:25,700 --> 00:24:25,920 Yes. 367 00:24:25,980 --> 00:24:28,720 150,000 euros for the two invoices. 368 00:24:30,020 --> 00:24:32,860 They still haven't been... 369 00:24:32,860 --> 00:24:35,780 There's still six. There's still six events due. 370 00:24:36,380 --> 00:24:38,540 Yeah, so we're contracted to do another six. 371 00:24:38,560 --> 00:24:39,980 And where is that money now at the minute? 372 00:24:40,520 --> 00:24:41,320 Whose account is it in? 373 00:24:42,440 --> 00:24:43,240 If that's in Tuttle. 374 00:24:43,680 --> 00:24:44,540 In Tuttle's account. 375 00:24:44,580 --> 00:24:44,800 Yes. 376 00:24:45,200 --> 00:24:46,140 Tuttle's after you. 377 00:24:46,260 --> 00:24:47,500 He's not the Lay Late Show presenter. 378 00:24:47,500 --> 00:24:49,820 Well, that's only now. 379 00:24:50,120 --> 00:24:52,080 And is that money that should go back to... 380 00:24:52,080 --> 00:24:52,580 Absolutely. 381 00:24:52,820 --> 00:24:54,900 I mean, the reality with that is that there are... 382 00:24:54,900 --> 00:24:55,980 And have you made... 383 00:24:55,980 --> 00:24:57,920 There has been no contact made on that issue. 384 00:24:58,300 --> 00:25:04,080 But what I'll say to you is that that is referring to six outstanding appearances that were to be made for Renault. 385 00:25:04,500 --> 00:25:06,340 As you know, I'm not finished, if I may. 386 00:25:06,700 --> 00:25:08,920 So I chose to leave the Late Late Show. 387 00:25:08,920 --> 00:25:08,920 So I chose to leave the Late Late Show. 388 00:25:08,920 --> 00:25:12,740 So, as I mentioned last summer, I made a decision to leave the Late Late Show. 389 00:25:13,080 --> 00:25:14,260 The stories are conflating a little. 390 00:25:14,300 --> 00:25:15,080 We can get to that later. 391 00:25:15,640 --> 00:25:18,580 But that's still outstanding work to be done. 392 00:25:18,760 --> 00:25:22,720 If that work is not called upon to be done, of course, money goes back. 393 00:25:23,000 --> 00:25:24,840 Money goes back. 394 00:25:26,040 --> 00:25:27,320 McPhail, thank you very much. 395 00:25:27,420 --> 00:25:29,100 And Ryan Renault, thank you very much. 396 00:25:32,160 --> 00:25:37,420 McPhail says, the glasses are giving me Nuremberg trial vibes. 397 00:25:38,380 --> 00:25:38,900 Is that what you're saying? 398 00:25:38,960 --> 00:25:39,180 Yes. 399 00:25:39,400 --> 00:25:40,640 I could be out of a job by Friday. 400 00:25:41,920 --> 00:25:42,940 Jesus Christ. 401 00:25:44,760 --> 00:25:45,560 Moving on. 402 00:25:45,960 --> 00:25:46,600 Senator... 403 00:25:46,600 --> 00:25:47,020 No, sorry. 404 00:25:47,120 --> 00:25:47,600 Deputy... 405 00:25:47,600 --> 00:25:48,220 Heavy buzz. 406 00:25:48,240 --> 00:25:48,820 Imelda Munster. 407 00:25:50,760 --> 00:25:52,120 Imelda Munster. 408 00:25:52,140 --> 00:25:52,580 Good to see you again. 409 00:25:54,320 --> 00:25:58,100 I just want to start off, I suppose, firstly by saying we much... 410 00:25:58,100 --> 00:26:04,360 Well, I certainly know I would much prefer to be focusing on the abysmal lack of corporate governance within RTE. 411 00:26:04,360 --> 00:26:07,960 But it's fairness to say that you did ask to come here. 412 00:26:08,160 --> 00:26:13,040 So, to put your side on the record and to answer questions of us. 413 00:26:14,080 --> 00:26:15,280 And I just want to... 414 00:26:16,360 --> 00:26:22,820 Yourself, Mr. Turbity first, I mean, you sat through three hours this morning and then we had the hour break. 415 00:26:22,940 --> 00:26:28,100 But just over the break, on reflection, do you accept that in reality, 416 00:26:28,400 --> 00:26:31,560 and I know one of the deputies raised it a few minutes ago, 417 00:26:32,040 --> 00:26:37,120 that you didn't actually take the 20% pay cut when you take on board 418 00:26:37,120 --> 00:26:42,840 the tripartite agreement that paid you 75,000? 419 00:26:43,040 --> 00:26:45,800 I understand why that perception is out there. 420 00:26:45,800 --> 00:26:45,960 But I... 421 00:26:45,960 --> 00:26:50,700 Someone get the door, hey! 422 00:26:50,700 --> 00:27:05,700 The difference between being paid separately by Renault versus being paid by RT and then the pay cut involved and then trying to explain that also the accumulation of pay cuts to take it from 40% pay cuts since 2012. 423 00:27:05,700 --> 00:27:08,460 I mean, I have tried to reflect that. 424 00:27:08,460 --> 00:27:15,420 But in answer to your question, which is obviously a very fair question, I can understand why there is confusion and I can understand why there is confusion. 425 00:27:15,420 --> 00:27:21,140 For fuck's sake, will someone get that? I think that's Tuttle. Tuttle's at the door, will you let them in? 426 00:27:21,140 --> 00:27:37,580 But in reality, and that's why I said in reality, RTE actually footed that bill. The public purse footed that bill. They had no business underwriting a separate commercial detail. But they actually paid the 375,000 payments. 427 00:27:37,580 --> 00:28:07,560 No, no, no, no. There's 375,000. Sorry. No, sorry. This is why... And I say this really respectfully. This is why I am in such a terrible state at the moment. Because there's been so much misunderstanding and misreporting. And, you know, about this. And about these figures. And, you know, that figure you just mentioned. That's not a real figure at all. And it's not a fair figure. And, you know, it just gets thrown at your head. And, you know, you're trying to... That's why we're here today. To try and... 428 00:28:07,560 --> 00:28:37,540 To try and write that. Because, unfortunately, like that story, Doubt, you know, when a feather leaves the pillow, it's very hard to get that back. And, unfortunately, with my good name, the feather has left the pillow. That's right. I'm hoping that you're trying to put the feather back in the pillow. And I'm hoping that you can put the feather back in the pillow, as you say. I appreciate that. Thank you, Deputy. The 275 payments, the third, second and third year, they were paid by RTE. Again, they were paid by ASTAS. Yes, but RTE paid 429 00:28:37,540 --> 00:28:39,580 made those payments to ASTAS. 430 00:28:39,980 --> 00:28:42,800 The payments to us were ASTAS. 431 00:28:43,000 --> 00:28:44,520 Yes, but they came from RTE. 432 00:28:44,680 --> 00:28:46,080 But we didn't know that. That's it. 433 00:28:46,120 --> 00:28:46,980 No, but that's what I'm saying. 434 00:28:47,120 --> 00:28:48,660 Yeah, that's the reason we didn't know that. 435 00:28:48,680 --> 00:28:50,760 But you know now in hindsight... 436 00:28:50,760 --> 00:28:51,160 Oh, yeah. 437 00:28:51,300 --> 00:28:53,040 ...whether you didn't know at the time or not. 438 00:28:53,040 --> 00:28:54,340 There's another question, Mr Kelly. 439 00:28:54,540 --> 00:28:54,860 Oh, yeah. 440 00:28:55,100 --> 00:28:57,480 But you know now that RTE paid those payments. 441 00:28:58,100 --> 00:29:01,620 So that was my question to you initially, Ryan, 442 00:29:01,780 --> 00:29:06,720 in relation to the tripartite would have made up for the 20%. 443 00:29:06,720 --> 00:29:09,000 But even if you dispute that, and that's fair enough for us. 444 00:29:09,000 --> 00:29:10,960 No, no, what I would say to you is... 445 00:29:10,960 --> 00:29:15,680 John, we had a tripartite agreement and we need one staff. 446 00:29:16,400 --> 00:29:17,420 Renault are at the door. 447 00:29:18,160 --> 00:29:19,820 They're barking at the door, John. 448 00:29:21,100 --> 00:29:22,120 Renault are hungry. 449 00:29:23,240 --> 00:29:25,400 About, you know, if you don't do that work... 450 00:29:25,400 --> 00:29:26,720 Renault need to eat, John. 451 00:29:26,840 --> 00:29:27,700 What happens with that money? 452 00:29:27,920 --> 00:29:28,840 The money goes back. 453 00:29:29,080 --> 00:29:30,740 The money. Where's the money going? 454 00:29:31,160 --> 00:29:32,660 So I totally understand that. 455 00:29:32,700 --> 00:29:34,520 I hope that answers your question a bit better maybe than earlier. 456 00:29:34,520 --> 00:29:36,800 And just in relation to that... 457 00:29:36,800 --> 00:29:41,600 Why did you not discuss your years with St Joseph's spy scout movement? 458 00:29:41,800 --> 00:29:45,240 Except that that was wrong of RTE to use the public purse to pay that. 459 00:29:45,240 --> 00:29:46,300 I think it's been like... 460 00:29:46,300 --> 00:29:50,060 What I would say to you, I'm not here to be critical of RTE. 461 00:29:50,800 --> 00:29:52,680 I've been working there since I was 12 years old. 462 00:29:52,800 --> 00:29:55,060 You know, it's a very important place to me. 463 00:29:55,420 --> 00:29:57,220 But I have to defend myself. 464 00:29:58,040 --> 00:29:58,280 OK? 465 00:29:58,440 --> 00:30:02,120 And the new Director General of RTE has asked for maximum transparency. 466 00:30:02,220 --> 00:30:03,640 That's what he said in the last 48 hours. 467 00:30:04,580 --> 00:30:05,240 That's why I'm here. 468 00:30:05,960 --> 00:30:06,060 OK. 469 00:30:07,060 --> 00:30:10,500 So you accepted that was wrong for them to pay out of the public purse? 470 00:30:10,700 --> 00:30:13,640 It strikes me as being unorthodox. 471 00:30:15,080 --> 00:30:16,220 Troker, thank you very much. 472 00:30:16,300 --> 00:30:17,580 Check for scum, thank you very much. 473 00:30:17,600 --> 00:30:19,680 I just wanted to ask Mr Kelly... 474 00:30:19,680 --> 00:30:20,560 No crane, no gain. 475 00:30:20,620 --> 00:30:21,320 Thank you very much. 476 00:30:21,400 --> 00:30:27,020 I mean, I find it very hard to believe, or I just don't find it credible, 477 00:30:28,160 --> 00:30:32,960 that you said earlier this morning that RTE initiated this whole deal. 478 00:30:33,360 --> 00:30:37,040 That RTE were the instigators of this tripartite deal. 479 00:30:37,040 --> 00:30:47,000 But what I can't figure out is, why, if your client was the only one to benefit from such a deal, 480 00:30:47,640 --> 00:30:57,260 why would RTE be the one to initiate a deal to develop that deal that's going to cost them money by underwriting? 481 00:30:58,480 --> 00:31:01,680 But yet, your client was the only one to benefit by that. 482 00:31:02,120 --> 00:31:03,040 I mean, just... 483 00:31:04,160 --> 00:31:05,040 It's clear there was... 484 00:31:06,000 --> 00:31:06,900 You wanted a... 485 00:31:06,900 --> 00:31:07,920 You feathered... 486 00:31:07,920 --> 00:31:10,600 You feathered your pillow, thank you very much. 487 00:31:10,700 --> 00:31:12,440 And a guaranteed and underwritten payment... 488 00:31:12,440 --> 00:31:13,660 Mama Duck, thank you very much. 489 00:31:14,020 --> 00:31:14,720 By RTE. 490 00:31:15,620 --> 00:31:19,040 But at the same time, we were watching COVID spread from the east. 491 00:31:19,520 --> 00:31:23,040 And in February, while the emails were going back and forth... 492 00:31:23,040 --> 00:31:30,660 Around this deal, I think it was Italy had already gone into lockdown. 493 00:31:33,120 --> 00:31:33,520 So... 494 00:31:33,520 --> 00:31:35,460 The deal... 495 00:31:35,460 --> 00:31:36,760 That was in February, when Italy went into lockdown. 496 00:31:36,760 --> 00:31:37,380 We went into lockdown. 497 00:31:37,380 --> 00:31:38,920 And these emails were going round. 498 00:31:39,320 --> 00:31:47,200 So was it not a case that you saw a way for income to be guaranteed by RTE and lock them into that agreement? 499 00:31:47,780 --> 00:31:48,620 That they would have to... 500 00:31:48,620 --> 00:31:48,620 It's lockdown. 501 00:31:49,360 --> 00:31:53,620 They would have to forfeit up, which transpires that that's exactly what happened. 502 00:31:53,620 --> 00:31:58,000 I did the contract before COVID. 503 00:31:58,000 --> 00:32:02,300 The contract was done for the start of 2020 and COVID happened in March of 2020. 504 00:32:02,300 --> 00:32:03,460 Yeah, but no, I've just... 505 00:32:03,460 --> 00:32:05,000 Number two, Frank McCord. 506 00:32:05,320 --> 00:32:09,380 Italy had already gone into lockdown in February. 507 00:32:10,220 --> 00:32:12,600 These emails are going back and forth in February. 508 00:32:12,600 --> 00:32:13,600 But the contract... 509 00:32:13,600 --> 00:32:17,200 And you had requested RTE underwrite the agreement. 510 00:32:17,340 --> 00:32:18,540 You told us that this morning. 511 00:32:18,540 --> 00:32:18,980 Sure. 512 00:32:18,980 --> 00:32:24,160 You had requested that they lock that agreement, that they were the fall guy. 513 00:32:24,660 --> 00:32:25,280 Had this... 514 00:32:25,280 --> 00:32:25,280 Had this... 515 00:32:25,280 --> 00:32:25,680 Had this... 516 00:32:25,680 --> 00:32:30,140 If any sponsor pulled out or in the lack of no other sponsor. 517 00:32:30,540 --> 00:32:32,500 But you knew it was coming into COVID. 518 00:32:33,500 --> 00:32:34,280 You knew the lockdown... 519 00:32:34,280 --> 00:32:35,700 Or COVID was there. 520 00:32:36,280 --> 00:32:38,320 You knew the lockdown had already started. 521 00:32:38,320 --> 00:32:39,320 The likelihood it was going to come across. 522 00:32:39,320 --> 00:32:40,140 Thank you very much. 523 00:32:40,140 --> 00:32:42,240 And that was your way of locking in. 524 00:32:42,860 --> 00:32:48,000 Now, who's ultimately responsible for all of this? 525 00:32:48,060 --> 00:32:49,140 I've said it from the beginning. 526 00:32:49,660 --> 00:32:51,500 The Executive Board of RTE. 527 00:32:52,080 --> 00:32:56,820 They're the one that underwritt a commercial deal that they had no business doing. 528 00:32:56,920 --> 00:32:59,080 They're the one that raised false invoices. 529 00:32:59,080 --> 00:33:20,380 Tonight at nine on Dispatches. 530 00:33:22,120 --> 00:33:23,280 NK Ultra. 531 00:33:23,900 --> 00:33:25,520 The Cadbury's Chocolate Man. 532 00:33:28,340 --> 00:33:30,340 Tonight at nine on Dispatches. 533 00:33:38,060 --> 00:33:41,300 The Solicitor who sat behind the Chocolate Man. 534 00:33:42,360 --> 00:33:43,960 Renault Cadbury's Corporate. 535 00:33:48,740 --> 00:33:50,660 You are a liar. 536 00:33:50,960 --> 00:33:52,400 2020 when everybody... 537 00:33:52,400 --> 00:33:54,940 When people had to work from home. 538 00:33:55,420 --> 00:33:56,900 This was well before that. 539 00:33:57,200 --> 00:33:58,280 What I was asking them to do. 540 00:33:58,280 --> 00:33:59,000 And it wasn't... 541 00:33:59,000 --> 00:34:00,720 I never wanted our teacher to underwrite this. 542 00:34:00,800 --> 00:34:01,720 This was always a relationship. 543 00:34:01,900 --> 00:34:02,780 A separate agreement for Renault. 544 00:34:03,080 --> 00:34:04,520 Six golden handshakes. 545 00:34:04,600 --> 00:34:05,040 Thanks very much. 546 00:34:05,120 --> 00:34:05,880 And Renault Cadbury. 547 00:34:06,240 --> 00:34:07,720 Lot of waffle going on here. 548 00:34:07,840 --> 00:34:08,420 A macaron show. 549 00:34:08,500 --> 00:34:09,020 Thank you very much. 550 00:34:09,480 --> 00:34:10,600 Lot of waffling going on. 551 00:34:10,700 --> 00:34:11,240 And I don't... 552 00:34:11,800 --> 00:34:13,920 Why is this solicitor just sat behind? 553 00:34:14,400 --> 00:34:16,280 I know he's obviously prepping them and giving them... 554 00:34:16,960 --> 00:34:17,480 Look at Ryan. 555 00:34:17,560 --> 00:34:18,380 Look at the shiftiness. 556 00:34:18,380 --> 00:34:20,720 It was just a one-year agreement. 557 00:34:20,880 --> 00:34:21,440 They just did... 558 00:34:21,440 --> 00:34:23,160 They did just the one-year agreement. 559 00:34:23,220 --> 00:34:24,380 No, it was a five-year agreement. 560 00:34:25,100 --> 00:34:26,600 And Renault is still responsible. 561 00:34:26,600 --> 00:34:31,760 The first two years, 20 and 21, were pushed out because of COVID. 562 00:34:31,840 --> 00:34:34,320 The first lot of events happened in 22. 563 00:34:34,880 --> 00:34:36,320 And then the other six are owed. 564 00:34:36,440 --> 00:34:39,380 And as Ryan said, if they want them to be honoured... 565 00:34:39,380 --> 00:34:40,920 And we're still in contract, he will honour them. 566 00:34:40,960 --> 00:34:42,300 And if they don't, he will hand the money back. 567 00:34:42,920 --> 00:34:47,400 But RTE had underwritten that agreement at your request. 568 00:34:48,480 --> 00:34:53,600 What RTE were underwriting with me was that they would interact with whatever new sponsor was there. 569 00:34:53,680 --> 00:34:55,540 But again, all under instruction from RTE. 570 00:34:56,100 --> 00:34:58,660 You must give the money back. 571 00:34:58,660 --> 00:35:01,640 It's plausible that, as I said, you're trying to see anyone to benefit. 572 00:35:01,780 --> 00:35:02,740 We are coming into COVID. 573 00:35:02,940 --> 00:35:03,700 You sought them. 574 00:35:05,180 --> 00:35:08,320 You asked, negotiated that they underwrite the agreement. 575 00:35:08,580 --> 00:35:09,100 I'm not... 576 00:35:09,100 --> 00:35:12,820 I mean, they're responsible for underwriting it and all the shenanigans we've seen since. 577 00:35:13,420 --> 00:35:15,320 But at the end of the day... 578 00:35:15,320 --> 00:35:17,060 A bit of whispering going on there. 579 00:35:17,200 --> 00:35:17,660 But just... 580 00:35:17,660 --> 00:35:18,840 I've only a couple of seconds left. 581 00:35:18,900 --> 00:35:19,480 Just one final question. 582 00:35:19,480 --> 00:35:20,520 A couple of seconds left. 583 00:35:20,940 --> 00:35:28,460 Mr. Kelly, when RTE published the salaries, and particularly your client's salary, 584 00:35:28,600 --> 00:35:32,280 you would have known that that wasn't correct as such, right? 585 00:35:32,420 --> 00:35:34,800 And you'd have checked the published figures. 586 00:35:35,220 --> 00:35:38,440 But even for the sake of your own client, optically, 587 00:35:38,500 --> 00:35:41,020 why did you not... 588 00:35:41,020 --> 00:35:45,400 The fact that they were being misrepresented, what did you do about that? 589 00:35:45,480 --> 00:35:51,340 Well, we had asked before, because, again, the top salary is 10 or 15 minutes notice. 590 00:35:51,540 --> 00:35:52,260 Then they're out. 591 00:35:52,360 --> 00:35:53,400 It's January or Friday. 592 00:35:54,460 --> 00:35:58,000 So we put in the contract that we wanted at least... 593 00:35:58,000 --> 00:35:59,900 Could we have 48 hours of notification? 594 00:36:00,160 --> 00:36:03,920 If we'd had notification and all of this, we would have been able to say, this is wrong. 595 00:36:04,100 --> 00:36:05,640 But you didn't call it out after it? 596 00:36:05,640 --> 00:36:06,080 No, we did. 597 00:36:06,140 --> 00:36:08,880 We actually put it in the contract negotiations that we want to be informed. 598 00:36:08,880 --> 00:36:15,940 But publicly, I'm saying, it would have saved him a lot, your client, a lot of hassle and having to explain things. 599 00:36:16,040 --> 00:36:16,360 You didn't... 600 00:36:16,360 --> 00:36:21,620 So in the document, page six, you'll see, please note that these matters are private and confidential. 601 00:36:21,820 --> 00:36:28,720 Any PR, as in figures and fees going out, any PR set to be released by RTE needs to be discussed in advance of any publication. 602 00:36:29,200 --> 00:36:31,380 This includes salaries and pay cuts. 603 00:36:31,920 --> 00:36:36,560 So we, like, of course you want to see them, but they're out, you know, literally. 604 00:36:36,660 --> 00:36:38,220 Yeah, but you could have set the record straight. 605 00:36:38,220 --> 00:36:41,340 But that's exactly what we did there, page six of this document. 606 00:36:41,420 --> 00:36:42,340 That's exactly what we were doing. 607 00:36:42,340 --> 00:36:42,580 Oh, this document. 608 00:36:42,740 --> 00:36:43,760 I'm talking about publicly. 609 00:36:43,960 --> 00:36:49,800 You would have saved, Mr Tupperty, a lot of questions and hassle had you called it out publicly at the time. 610 00:36:50,520 --> 00:36:55,440 But as you can see, under declaration, over declaration, RTE put these figures out, not us. 611 00:36:55,860 --> 00:36:58,820 And if we had put them out, and also they were stated... 612 00:36:58,820 --> 00:37:07,560 It just seems to be, and I'm not saying they're in the thick of it, but you're seeing everything today is RTE's fault, RTE's fault, RTE's fault. 613 00:37:07,560 --> 00:37:14,080 This is a simple enough question that you, as your client's agent, could have publicly rectified. 614 00:37:14,760 --> 00:37:19,860 It's not the biggest issue, but you could have publicly rectified it, and you chose not to. 615 00:37:20,260 --> 00:37:23,640 We informed RTE, and we also tried to put it in as part of the contract. 616 00:37:24,380 --> 00:37:26,700 RTE are the ones that keep on sending the figures out, not us. 617 00:37:27,300 --> 00:37:28,260 You didn't correct it. 618 00:37:28,320 --> 00:37:29,020 I have to move on. 619 00:37:29,080 --> 00:37:30,080 Thank you, Deputy Munster. 620 00:37:30,200 --> 00:37:30,700 Thank you, Deputy. 621 00:37:30,940 --> 00:37:32,460 Calling on Peter Fitzpatrick. 622 00:37:32,980 --> 00:37:33,740 Deputy, Peter Fitzpatrick. 623 00:37:33,760 --> 00:37:36,840 I'd just like to welcome our witnesses, and I just hope that we can get the truth. 624 00:37:37,440 --> 00:37:39,160 My first few questions will be... 625 00:37:39,160 --> 00:37:40,160 We want the truth! 626 00:37:40,440 --> 00:37:43,660 The first one will be, RTE engaged in the deceptive practices. 627 00:37:44,240 --> 00:37:44,820 You're not a killer. 628 00:37:45,000 --> 00:37:45,440 No, I'm not. 629 00:37:45,980 --> 00:37:49,120 Misrepresentation of financial reporting and hiding information. 630 00:37:49,700 --> 00:37:51,260 Yes, RTE was responsible. 631 00:37:51,700 --> 00:37:53,800 But you didn't take action to resolve these errors. 632 00:37:54,520 --> 00:37:55,080 This is an... 633 00:37:55,080 --> 00:37:56,720 Patrick Keelsey, thank you very much. 634 00:37:57,220 --> 00:37:58,380 No, of course I don't. 635 00:37:58,380 --> 00:37:59,740 Hey, Patrick Keelsey here. 636 00:37:59,940 --> 00:38:03,340 Just wondering if you wanted to be the next host of the Lit Lit Show. 637 00:38:03,460 --> 00:38:04,920 Couldn't be arsed myself anymore. 638 00:38:05,120 --> 00:38:06,740 The questions that are... 639 00:38:06,740 --> 00:38:08,280 Thanks very much, Pat, for the tip. 640 00:38:08,360 --> 00:38:09,180 Your question. 641 00:38:09,920 --> 00:38:12,080 So you're saying you didn't hide payments? 642 00:38:12,320 --> 00:38:12,520 No. 643 00:38:12,700 --> 00:38:14,800 You didn't misrepresent the financial reporting? 644 00:38:15,160 --> 00:38:15,300 No. 645 00:38:15,360 --> 00:38:17,180 And you're hiding no information? 646 00:38:17,420 --> 00:38:17,700 Correct. 647 00:38:18,040 --> 00:38:18,240 Okay. 648 00:38:18,840 --> 00:38:22,700 Do you realise that the people are looking up to you, and they really, really feel let down with you? 649 00:38:23,120 --> 00:38:28,120 I don't know all these people are rubbing your shoulders and rubbing your hand, because I tell you one, if you came to County Loud, it would be the opposite. 650 00:38:29,000 --> 00:38:29,320 Loud. 651 00:38:29,320 --> 00:38:30,320 See the face. 652 00:38:30,320 --> 00:38:32,720 On the 3rd of March, you shut down talks of you leaving the Lit Lit Show. 653 00:38:33,140 --> 00:38:33,840 See the face. 654 00:38:33,840 --> 00:38:34,160 You had a cushion number. 655 00:38:34,580 --> 00:38:35,280 You were well liked. 656 00:38:35,700 --> 00:38:36,680 Nobody would give you a wimp. 657 00:38:37,360 --> 00:38:39,620 A week later, pressure started to be arsed. 658 00:38:39,860 --> 00:38:40,660 Look at that phone, look. 659 00:38:40,660 --> 00:38:41,380 It's on charge. 660 00:38:41,880 --> 00:38:42,680 It's precarious. 661 00:38:42,820 --> 00:38:47,220 You repeatedly stated this morning, Committee, that you were leaving the Lit Lit Show had nothing to do with this. 662 00:38:47,700 --> 00:38:49,300 As you put it, the current fiasco. 663 00:38:50,080 --> 00:38:52,920 You stated this time in the Simply Co-entrance. 664 00:38:53,260 --> 00:38:57,260 You stated in your statement that you first became aware of the Grand Tartan Review in May. 665 00:38:57,780 --> 00:38:58,380 It's just true. 666 00:38:59,700 --> 00:39:00,100 Deputy. 667 00:39:00,940 --> 00:39:01,820 I'm only asking a question. 668 00:39:02,020 --> 00:39:02,680 And I'm only answering. 669 00:39:02,920 --> 00:39:03,100 Yes. 670 00:39:03,220 --> 00:39:03,700 He's riled. 671 00:39:03,940 --> 00:39:04,480 He's riled. 672 00:39:04,660 --> 00:39:05,240 Let me tell you. 673 00:39:05,540 --> 00:39:06,260 He's fucking riled. 674 00:39:06,260 --> 00:39:06,640 You didn't. 675 00:39:08,060 --> 00:39:08,900 Let me tell you. 676 00:39:09,280 --> 00:39:09,560 Yeah. 677 00:39:10,200 --> 00:39:10,460 Yeah. 678 00:39:10,680 --> 00:39:11,040 Yeah. 679 00:39:11,600 --> 00:39:20,420 Your dismissal of the good people of Ireland who have the courtesy and the kindness to approach me on the street is not something I appreciate on their behalf. 680 00:39:20,580 --> 00:39:21,020 Secondly. 681 00:39:21,160 --> 00:39:21,760 They approach me too. 682 00:39:21,940 --> 00:39:22,220 Deputy. 683 00:39:22,880 --> 00:39:25,800 Secondly, I wish I'd brought them with me in some ways. 684 00:39:26,240 --> 00:39:33,340 The countless cards and letters I've received from people around the country speaking words of kindness and indeed wisdom. 685 00:39:33,340 --> 00:39:36,760 And I wouldn't like to dismiss their decency either. 686 00:39:37,680 --> 00:39:39,260 Thirdly, no. 687 00:39:40,380 --> 00:39:45,740 If you had been made aware, would you have stayed in your position until the end of the day? 688 00:39:45,740 --> 00:39:46,760 Columbus behaviour. 689 00:39:46,940 --> 00:39:47,700 Thank you very much. 690 00:39:47,840 --> 00:39:48,260 If you knew. 691 00:39:48,460 --> 00:39:48,780 If you didn't know. 692 00:39:48,780 --> 00:39:52,080 It is a hypothetical that is unbecoming. 693 00:39:52,280 --> 00:39:52,740 It's a question. 694 00:39:52,800 --> 00:39:53,400 It's a question. 695 00:39:53,560 --> 00:39:54,560 No, but I would also say. 696 00:39:55,540 --> 00:39:59,200 I get the sense that you choose not to believe my reason for leaving the legislature. 697 00:39:59,200 --> 00:40:00,740 I'm only asking a question for me to ask my people. 698 00:40:00,980 --> 00:40:01,480 I'm a deputy. 699 00:40:01,780 --> 00:40:01,980 Yeah. 700 00:40:02,200 --> 00:40:02,500 Please. 701 00:40:03,180 --> 00:40:04,360 I'm only answering your question. 702 00:40:04,360 --> 00:40:05,000 I have answered you. 703 00:40:05,320 --> 00:40:08,700 I have answered you quite clearly. 704 00:40:08,880 --> 00:40:09,700 That's the word no. 705 00:40:10,180 --> 00:40:13,780 And equally with my answer to you regarding the Late Late Show. 706 00:40:13,900 --> 00:40:15,160 If you choose not to believe me. 707 00:40:15,540 --> 00:40:21,400 I think that's a terrible pity because you live with a lack of truth then. 708 00:40:22,000 --> 00:40:25,000 If OTE were overstating the amount of money that we're paying you. 709 00:40:25,680 --> 00:40:26,000 I'm sorry. 710 00:40:26,000 --> 00:40:26,600 I can't hear you. 711 00:40:26,780 --> 00:40:28,980 If OTE were overstating the amount of money. 712 00:40:29,080 --> 00:40:30,100 He's using the whole. 713 00:40:30,220 --> 00:40:31,000 I can't hear you. 714 00:40:31,000 --> 00:40:31,400 I can't hear you. 715 00:40:32,220 --> 00:40:32,660 Sorry. 716 00:40:32,760 --> 00:40:33,580 I can't hear you. 717 00:40:34,040 --> 00:40:37,700 They're in like a quiet fucking acoustically optimized room. 718 00:40:38,280 --> 00:40:38,720 What? 719 00:40:39,640 --> 00:40:40,380 I'm sorry. 720 00:40:41,100 --> 00:40:41,300 No. 721 00:40:41,580 --> 00:40:42,120 Time's up. 722 00:40:42,360 --> 00:40:43,600 Gotta go guys. 723 00:40:44,000 --> 00:40:44,860 Coming up tonight. 724 00:40:46,740 --> 00:40:50,220 So would you be willing to be talking to overpayments to the public funds? 725 00:40:51,780 --> 00:40:53,180 You need to refer to the document. 726 00:40:53,180 --> 00:40:54,220 Oh thanks very much. 727 00:40:55,440 --> 00:40:56,440 Please answer the question. 728 00:40:57,440 --> 00:40:59,580 He's left his fucking phone on behind him. 729 00:40:59,660 --> 00:41:00,480 The politician look. 730 00:41:00,580 --> 00:41:01,640 It's getting notifications. 731 00:41:01,960 --> 00:41:04,980 By OTE because of their unfortunate account as the errors. 732 00:41:05,780 --> 00:41:06,480 I said over. 733 00:41:06,600 --> 00:41:08,840 I said if OTE were overstating the amount of money. 734 00:41:09,040 --> 00:41:10,920 And you knew they were overstating the amount of money. 735 00:41:11,300 --> 00:41:12,500 I'm asking you a question on the other side. 736 00:41:12,940 --> 00:41:14,040 In the public service. 737 00:41:14,460 --> 00:41:15,460 He's getting loads of messages. 738 00:41:15,760 --> 00:41:17,720 Any city that's overpayments is obliged to be talking to overpayments. 739 00:41:18,140 --> 00:41:19,960 Would you be willing to be talking to overpayments? 740 00:41:19,960 --> 00:41:22,520 The difficulty here is understatements. 741 00:41:24,380 --> 00:41:27,580 Did you have any other undisclosed commercial involvement with the third party? 742 00:41:29,260 --> 00:41:30,020 Again please. 743 00:41:30,540 --> 00:41:34,140 Did you have any other undisclosed commercial involvement with the third party? 744 00:41:34,240 --> 00:41:34,400 No. 745 00:41:34,700 --> 00:41:34,900 Okay. 746 00:41:36,440 --> 00:41:39,240 Did you really think that the people. 747 00:41:39,660 --> 00:41:40,400 The Reynolds deal. 748 00:41:41,040 --> 00:41:43,400 That people wouldn't think you're trying to avoid a pay cut. 749 00:41:43,660 --> 00:41:45,540 So people know about the Reynolds payment. 750 00:41:45,620 --> 00:41:48,280 Do you honestly think that people don't think one and one is two? 751 00:41:49,280 --> 00:41:57,840 I think that the nature of an independent contractor signing a deal with a different company is pretty complicated. 752 00:41:57,960 --> 00:42:00,920 To be honest with you I'm not a very smart man when it comes to these things. 753 00:42:01,160 --> 00:42:03,520 That's why I pay a smart man to do that for me. 754 00:42:03,880 --> 00:42:06,940 So you'll have to forgive me for not having a great grasp of the detail here. 755 00:42:06,940 --> 00:42:11,280 But I never set out to cause any confusion to anyone at any time. 756 00:42:11,400 --> 00:42:11,580 Ever. 757 00:42:12,620 --> 00:42:16,660 I never underestimate the intelligence and the decency of the Irish people. 758 00:42:17,120 --> 00:42:27,140 Well it is difficult for the Irish people to reconcile that the Reynolds deal was an entirely separate arrangement when it was formed part of the 2020 contract negotiation. 759 00:42:28,300 --> 00:42:29,700 What gives rise to Dee Forbes? 760 00:42:29,900 --> 00:42:31,800 She'll be side note on the 19th December. 761 00:42:32,600 --> 00:42:35,680 Did you make a threat that you're going to walk with your job? 762 00:42:36,100 --> 00:42:40,060 At the time through your weekly radio shows and as a presenter of the flagship show. 763 00:42:40,060 --> 00:42:40,920 Thank you very much. 764 00:42:40,920 --> 00:42:46,980 Andy the Fork thank you very much. 765 00:42:47,520 --> 00:42:48,960 Under severe financial pressure. 766 00:42:49,580 --> 00:42:51,780 Did you leverage this fact and did you pressure... 767 00:42:51,780 --> 00:42:55,060 And Tubbs as well says zoom in on my face again and I'll burst you. 768 00:42:55,960 --> 00:42:56,800 It never come up. 769 00:42:57,100 --> 00:42:59,220 I didn't negotiate with the Director General Deputy. 770 00:42:59,300 --> 00:43:00,260 It's not me doing it. 771 00:43:00,340 --> 00:43:01,740 I gave them back money as it happens. 772 00:43:01,960 --> 00:43:03,460 No luck fill you in on that if you wish to hear. 773 00:43:03,460 --> 00:43:04,180 Oh look who it is. 774 00:43:04,180 --> 00:43:06,280 He's going to really go to town. 775 00:43:06,440 --> 00:43:06,700 Let's book. 776 00:43:06,780 --> 00:43:09,620 You're putting sole blame on OTE regarding this fiasco. 777 00:43:10,360 --> 00:43:21,980 Why did you ask OTE, a public body, to guarantee payments due from Reynolds, a substantial private company, to have rank-tumbly commercial obligations underwritten with taxpayers' money? 778 00:43:22,960 --> 00:43:29,280 Mr Tubbs always said in the show, we're all in it together and this money is public money. 779 00:43:30,560 --> 00:43:32,120 Do you think this is unacceptable? 780 00:43:32,120 --> 00:43:38,480 So firstly, the agreement with Renault is with RTE. 781 00:43:39,180 --> 00:43:42,760 In relation to public money we were paid by Renault. 782 00:43:43,420 --> 00:43:44,420 Our understanding... 783 00:43:44,420 --> 00:43:45,520 So you were paid by OTE? 784 00:43:45,840 --> 00:43:46,800 No, we were paid by Renault. 785 00:43:47,080 --> 00:43:47,940 We were paid by Renault. 786 00:43:48,420 --> 00:43:50,240 And then we were paid by Astus. 787 00:43:50,960 --> 00:43:54,120 And we understood that Astus was involved with Renault. 788 00:43:54,120 --> 00:43:59,820 So at all times we were actually on construction from RTE. 789 00:44:01,300 --> 00:44:03,160 The relationship with Renault is with RTE. 790 00:44:03,400 --> 00:44:04,020 It's not with us. 791 00:44:05,480 --> 00:44:14,160 RTE rejects the claim that incorrect versions of events were presented to New Yorkers there last week regarding the RTE agreement to underwrite payments. 792 00:44:14,720 --> 00:44:17,400 Within your pack you provided email evidence to prove your point. 793 00:44:18,220 --> 00:44:19,440 Casey, thank you very much. 794 00:44:19,520 --> 00:44:20,160 I'm sure you know that. 795 00:44:20,300 --> 00:44:20,520 Sure. 796 00:44:20,780 --> 00:44:23,480 The position of either party could easily change in minutes or days. 797 00:44:23,900 --> 00:44:25,800 Can you show us the actual contract? 798 00:44:27,200 --> 00:44:28,340 So the contract... 799 00:44:28,340 --> 00:44:29,600 Do you have an actual contract? 800 00:44:38,220 --> 00:44:39,640 Exactly what contract? 801 00:44:39,820 --> 00:44:41,540 Blackboard Jungle, confer. 802 00:44:43,620 --> 00:44:47,000 You're saying that you had agreement by an email, right? 803 00:44:47,260 --> 00:44:49,200 I'm saying do you actually have a physical contract? 804 00:44:49,860 --> 00:44:52,100 You know what... 805 00:44:52,100 --> 00:44:52,880 Sorry, sorry, sorry. 806 00:44:53,020 --> 00:44:54,320 Do you have a contract? 807 00:44:54,460 --> 00:44:54,940 I appreciate it, sorry. 808 00:44:56,980 --> 00:44:58,880 As you said... 809 00:44:58,880 --> 00:44:59,760 Yes or no? 810 00:44:59,840 --> 00:45:00,360 Do you have a contract? 811 00:45:01,200 --> 00:45:01,480 We... 812 00:45:01,480 --> 00:45:01,980 We... 813 00:45:01,980 --> 00:45:02,980 We... 814 00:45:02,980 --> 00:45:03,400 For it. 815 00:45:04,100 --> 00:45:04,640 I'm sorry. 816 00:45:04,700 --> 00:45:05,380 I don't mean to flushing you. 817 00:45:05,520 --> 00:45:05,840 Sorry. 818 00:45:07,360 --> 00:45:11,660 We're dealing with a 350 million euro operation, RT. 819 00:45:11,880 --> 00:45:12,260 Huge. 820 00:45:13,320 --> 00:45:17,940 I, at any time, would just assume that they knew what they were doing. 821 00:45:18,260 --> 00:45:19,520 We have a contract. 822 00:45:20,080 --> 00:45:25,840 The email from the CFO confirms that this is their position. 823 00:45:26,340 --> 00:45:28,100 And again, there's no secret. 824 00:45:28,280 --> 00:45:29,160 There was no secret. 825 00:45:29,920 --> 00:45:32,700 And then Dee Forbes verbally said that they would honour the contract. 826 00:45:32,840 --> 00:45:34,280 All we wanted them to honour was... 827 00:45:34,280 --> 00:45:35,880 We never thought that RT would ever pay this. 828 00:45:35,980 --> 00:45:36,700 Ever, ever, ever. 829 00:45:37,160 --> 00:45:39,680 All we wanted them to do is if the sponsor changed, 830 00:45:40,040 --> 00:45:43,300 that we would be able to have an interaction with the sponsor. 831 00:45:43,300 --> 00:45:47,080 Because the relationship with the sponsor and RT, that's the relationship. 832 00:45:47,600 --> 00:45:48,880 So we needed to... 833 00:45:48,880 --> 00:45:53,800 If the sponsor changed, that we could renegotiate and rework what they may want to do. 834 00:45:54,160 --> 00:45:54,560 That was all. 835 00:45:55,200 --> 00:45:57,660 Mr. Huxtable there saying that the... 836 00:45:57,660 --> 00:45:59,960 It's Renault that keep on sending your man messages. 837 00:46:00,040 --> 00:46:02,380 You're a very, very successful negotiator. 838 00:46:02,600 --> 00:46:04,440 And three of your top talent is an OTE. 839 00:46:05,400 --> 00:46:06,980 Why was this not questioned? 840 00:46:07,700 --> 00:46:09,960 Neither of you are consultancies. 841 00:46:10,500 --> 00:46:12,940 If OTE told you to invoice a company you never heard of, 842 00:46:13,180 --> 00:46:14,400 why did you not question this? 843 00:46:14,600 --> 00:46:15,660 It makes no sense. 844 00:46:16,540 --> 00:46:19,680 I suppose it's obvious now. 845 00:46:19,780 --> 00:46:22,160 But at the time, we were just acting under instruction. 846 00:46:22,280 --> 00:46:23,640 We had been working with them for 23 years. 847 00:46:23,840 --> 00:46:29,600 I never saw any reason why RTE would be doing anything deceptive. 848 00:46:29,640 --> 00:46:30,040 Why would you? 849 00:46:30,040 --> 00:46:31,000 The national broadcaster. 850 00:46:31,360 --> 00:46:33,480 I'd listen and look and pay my licence like everybody else. 851 00:46:33,560 --> 00:46:34,020 Why would you? 852 00:46:34,120 --> 00:46:34,360 Honestly. 853 00:46:35,360 --> 00:46:35,640 Honestly. 854 00:46:37,480 --> 00:46:42,540 Do you have a relationship with the incoming Director General Kevin Blackheart? 855 00:46:42,540 --> 00:46:47,060 Since he previously sailed as a Deputy Director General. 856 00:46:47,200 --> 00:46:48,060 Do you have a relationship with him? 857 00:46:48,160 --> 00:46:49,600 I would have met him a couple of times. 858 00:46:49,920 --> 00:46:50,500 But the same. 859 00:46:50,640 --> 00:46:52,860 That is a total and absolute lie. 860 00:46:53,220 --> 00:46:55,680 No, but as I said, I wouldn't have... 861 00:46:55,680 --> 00:46:57,780 I don't have relationships with these people. 862 00:46:58,100 --> 00:47:01,700 We meet them with their lawyers, with their accountants, in their boardrooms. 863 00:47:02,700 --> 00:47:03,740 I don't have... 864 00:47:03,740 --> 00:47:05,220 I haven't had a cup of tea with them. 865 00:47:05,300 --> 00:47:06,120 I haven't had... 866 00:47:06,120 --> 00:47:07,120 You hammered your mother. 867 00:47:07,460 --> 00:47:08,620 These are just... 868 00:47:08,620 --> 00:47:15,800 These are people that you meet in the main tower in RTE when you're negotiating contracts. 869 00:47:15,920 --> 00:47:16,300 But I don't know... 870 00:47:16,300 --> 00:47:16,840 Game boy. 871 00:47:17,060 --> 00:47:17,900 They're not my friends. 872 00:47:18,080 --> 00:47:18,740 I don't know them. 873 00:47:19,320 --> 00:47:20,520 Don't you have a life? 874 00:47:21,720 --> 00:47:27,200 You docu-c signed the tripod contract, which was provided last week on behalf of Ryan Tuppity, 875 00:47:27,400 --> 00:47:29,200 on the 23rd of April this year. 876 00:47:29,960 --> 00:47:33,980 It is almost as if someone found out that the orders had discovered the unreported payments 877 00:47:33,980 --> 00:47:35,000 to Mr Tuppity. 878 00:47:35,660 --> 00:47:45,920 This is a lot better than the one earlier on. 879 00:47:46,620 --> 00:47:47,500 They're on the ropes. 880 00:47:47,960 --> 00:47:48,600 They're sweating. 881 00:47:48,760 --> 00:47:49,460 They're conferring. 882 00:47:50,300 --> 00:47:50,900 They're whispering. 883 00:47:51,460 --> 00:47:53,500 Two people seeing the jump ship at the same time, right? 884 00:47:54,420 --> 00:47:55,740 It's that coincidence as well. 885 00:47:55,840 --> 00:47:56,820 Everything seems to be a coincidence. 886 00:47:57,060 --> 00:47:58,380 Sorry, who's... 887 00:47:58,380 --> 00:47:59,840 I'll read the question again here, right? 888 00:48:01,060 --> 00:48:01,780 Who's jumping ship? 889 00:48:01,780 --> 00:48:01,940 Sorry. 890 00:48:02,260 --> 00:48:03,060 Who's jump ship? 891 00:48:03,380 --> 00:48:03,800 Sorry, sorry. 892 00:48:04,880 --> 00:48:06,760 Last week, people were jumping ship. 893 00:48:07,240 --> 00:48:07,540 Oh, from... 894 00:48:07,540 --> 00:48:08,340 I feel as though... 895 00:48:08,340 --> 00:48:08,880 From OTE? 896 00:48:09,160 --> 00:48:09,400 Yes. 897 00:48:10,700 --> 00:48:12,440 No, I think he means from their client. 898 00:48:13,820 --> 00:48:15,160 I feel as though that, like, 899 00:48:15,700 --> 00:48:19,340 Ryan Tuppity and Defoe have seen the jump ship at the same time, right? 900 00:48:19,660 --> 00:48:22,040 So I'm saying it's that coincidence as well. 901 00:48:23,100 --> 00:48:23,920 I wasn't jumping ship. 902 00:48:24,100 --> 00:48:24,400 I'm still... 903 00:48:24,400 --> 00:48:26,540 Ryan's still under contract. 904 00:48:26,940 --> 00:48:28,120 Sorry, he's not under contract. 905 00:48:28,420 --> 00:48:29,120 He is under contract. 906 00:48:29,520 --> 00:48:29,760 Fuck. 907 00:48:29,760 --> 00:48:30,020 His contract is... 908 00:48:30,020 --> 00:48:31,040 Mr Tuppity's contract... 909 00:48:31,040 --> 00:48:34,080 Richard Bad Boyd, thank you very much. 910 00:48:34,120 --> 00:48:35,760 Are you ready for me to grill these two? 911 00:48:37,080 --> 00:48:39,440 Sorry about my mic coming in hot there. 912 00:48:39,520 --> 00:48:40,700 Hopefully I didn't blow your ears off. 913 00:48:41,260 --> 00:48:41,960 Thanks, Richard. 914 00:48:42,440 --> 00:48:43,580 Bad Boyd Barrett. 915 00:48:43,740 --> 00:48:45,620 Yeah, renegotiate for radio only services, 916 00:48:45,760 --> 00:48:47,060 but the contract still stands. 917 00:48:47,160 --> 00:48:47,940 The contract is... 918 00:48:47,940 --> 00:48:48,580 Yeah, so... 919 00:48:48,580 --> 00:48:49,920 So the money you're getting at the moment 920 00:48:49,920 --> 00:48:51,180 is just for the radio station? 921 00:48:51,620 --> 00:48:53,180 That's my understanding of it, yes. 922 00:48:53,200 --> 00:48:53,380 No, sorry. 923 00:48:53,860 --> 00:48:55,180 You don't know what you're getting paid, no? 924 00:48:55,500 --> 00:48:57,120 I mean, Deputy, it's been a long three weeks, 925 00:48:57,300 --> 00:48:58,220 as I have to say. 926 00:48:58,340 --> 00:48:58,880 And I do know... 927 00:48:58,880 --> 00:48:59,700 You know what I'm getting paid. 928 00:48:59,700 --> 00:49:00,620 It's written in my contract. 929 00:49:00,720 --> 00:49:01,740 I'm here today to tell you that. 930 00:49:01,740 --> 00:49:04,120 But it is being currently, 931 00:49:04,640 --> 00:49:05,540 as Noel will tell you, 932 00:49:05,840 --> 00:49:06,700 it's being currently... 933 00:49:06,700 --> 00:49:08,080 They've suspended the negotiation. 934 00:49:08,620 --> 00:49:10,480 So that's why we're in a bit of abeyance at the moment 935 00:49:10,480 --> 00:49:11,180 until I'm told, 936 00:49:11,560 --> 00:49:12,600 as I said to you a minute ago, 937 00:49:12,640 --> 00:49:14,180 I could be out of a job on Friday 938 00:49:14,180 --> 00:49:16,380 or I could be back to work next Monday. 939 00:49:16,380 --> 00:49:17,600 So it's a sort of possibility 940 00:49:17,600 --> 00:49:19,580 that you could still be getting paid for the late-laced show. 941 00:49:19,760 --> 00:49:20,380 Oh, no, no, no. 942 00:49:20,380 --> 00:49:20,980 Not the late-laced show. 943 00:49:20,980 --> 00:49:21,240 Not the slightest. 944 00:49:21,480 --> 00:49:21,800 No, sorry. 945 00:49:21,900 --> 00:49:22,400 Not the slightest. 946 00:49:22,580 --> 00:49:23,100 So at the moment, 947 00:49:23,240 --> 00:49:25,160 all you're getting paid is for the radio station? 948 00:49:25,340 --> 00:49:26,100 Well, that's my understanding. 949 00:49:26,360 --> 00:49:26,560 Yes. 950 00:49:26,720 --> 00:49:28,580 TV services are finished. 951 00:49:28,900 --> 00:49:30,440 They finished at the last night of the show, 952 00:49:30,520 --> 00:49:31,340 which would have been in May. 953 00:49:31,840 --> 00:49:32,040 Absolutely. 954 00:49:32,480 --> 00:49:33,760 And to conclude... 955 00:49:33,760 --> 00:49:34,800 Just one second. 956 00:49:35,020 --> 00:49:35,240 No, sorry. 957 00:49:35,360 --> 00:49:35,360 No, sorry. 958 00:49:35,440 --> 00:49:35,940 No, sorry. 959 00:49:35,940 --> 00:49:36,300 Listen, 960 00:49:37,140 --> 00:49:38,180 I'm asking the questions 961 00:49:38,180 --> 00:49:40,720 that the people who put me in a job is here, right? 962 00:49:41,020 --> 00:49:42,880 People are very, very disappointed with you, right? 963 00:49:43,240 --> 00:49:44,040 And in fairness, 964 00:49:44,360 --> 00:49:45,440 I will put my hand up and say, 965 00:49:45,560 --> 00:49:46,840 fair play to you as coming here today. 966 00:49:47,320 --> 00:49:48,320 Like, you didn't have to come in here today, 967 00:49:48,380 --> 00:49:49,600 but you did come in here to ask the questions. 968 00:49:50,080 --> 00:49:50,900 But I'm just trying to say that 969 00:49:50,900 --> 00:49:52,180 people just want to know the truth 970 00:49:52,180 --> 00:49:53,300 of what's actually happening at the moment is. 971 00:49:54,060 --> 00:49:55,920 Sorry, last week and the week before, 972 00:49:56,160 --> 00:49:57,500 we seem to be told lies. 973 00:49:57,920 --> 00:49:59,160 All I'm hoping for is that 974 00:49:59,160 --> 00:50:01,120 the information that we got today from 40 years 975 00:50:01,120 --> 00:50:01,600 is the truth. 976 00:50:01,980 --> 00:50:02,780 And if it is the truth, 977 00:50:02,840 --> 00:50:03,620 we'll all put our hands up. 978 00:50:03,880 --> 00:50:05,080 But I'm just saying that the public... 979 00:50:05,080 --> 00:50:06,200 Thank you for the reason. 980 00:50:06,480 --> 00:50:07,760 It's Patrick, may ask it to be heard. 981 00:50:07,760 --> 00:50:08,060 And what I'm sorry is, 982 00:50:08,200 --> 00:50:09,140 it's the public money. 983 00:50:09,680 --> 00:50:12,440 It's this money that people are really sad over. 984 00:50:12,680 --> 00:50:13,460 Mr. Doberty, 985 00:50:13,680 --> 00:50:14,740 you're the one that kept mentioning 986 00:50:14,740 --> 00:50:15,640 the cost of living and living. 987 00:50:15,740 --> 00:50:17,060 You're the one in the programme. 988 00:50:17,460 --> 00:50:18,540 We all are in this together. 989 00:50:18,560 --> 00:50:19,120 It doesn't change how I felt. 990 00:50:19,620 --> 00:50:20,720 Thank you, Deputy Fitzpatrick. 991 00:50:20,780 --> 00:50:21,400 Can I move on? 992 00:50:22,120 --> 00:50:23,720 I love your county very much. 993 00:50:24,040 --> 00:50:25,720 See the way you feel. 994 00:50:26,060 --> 00:50:27,500 There's millions of people in Ireland feel rough. 995 00:50:27,820 --> 00:50:28,380 Fucking hell. 996 00:50:29,160 --> 00:50:30,400 Deputy Griffin, the floor is yours. 997 00:50:30,540 --> 00:50:31,080 Thanks very much. 998 00:50:31,320 --> 00:50:33,080 And thanks, Mr. Doberty and Mr. Doberty, 999 00:50:33,080 --> 00:50:34,720 for volunteering to come in. 1000 00:50:34,800 --> 00:50:36,360 And I think it's important that that's stressed as well 1001 00:50:36,360 --> 00:50:39,100 because this is very much forming a part, 1002 00:50:39,220 --> 00:50:40,860 particularly your appearance here, Mr. Doberty, 1003 00:50:40,940 --> 00:50:43,000 in terms of trying to rebuild confidence 1004 00:50:43,000 --> 00:50:44,060 in the national broadcaster. 1005 00:50:44,340 --> 00:50:45,060 For many people, 1006 00:50:45,180 --> 00:50:46,740 you personify RTE. 1007 00:50:48,020 --> 00:50:49,740 And as we saw when you were finishing up 1008 00:50:49,740 --> 00:50:50,360 the Late Late Show, 1009 00:50:50,420 --> 00:50:52,000 there was a massive outpouring of appreciation 1010 00:50:52,000 --> 00:50:52,900 for the job you did. 1011 00:50:53,140 --> 00:50:54,400 Over the last 14 years, 1012 00:50:54,540 --> 00:50:55,800 you would have received hundreds, 1013 00:50:55,940 --> 00:50:56,900 probably thousands of pieces 1014 00:50:56,900 --> 00:50:58,100 of messages, correspondence. 1015 00:50:58,280 --> 00:50:58,940 I was one of the people 1016 00:50:58,940 --> 00:51:00,100 who dropped you a note at the time 1017 00:51:00,100 --> 00:51:01,500 to wish you well in the future. 1018 00:51:02,220 --> 00:51:03,420 But people looking in now, 1019 00:51:03,520 --> 00:51:05,500 that confidence has been rattled. 1020 00:51:05,740 --> 00:51:05,920 Yes. 1021 00:51:05,920 --> 00:51:07,960 So today's hearing is very important 1022 00:51:07,960 --> 00:51:09,100 in terms of establishing the facts. 1023 00:51:09,180 --> 00:51:10,280 And that's what we're trying to do here. 1024 00:51:10,380 --> 00:51:10,580 Yes. 1025 00:51:10,640 --> 00:51:11,640 No one's out to get anyone. 1026 00:51:11,780 --> 00:51:13,340 We want to establish the true facts 1027 00:51:13,340 --> 00:51:14,840 for the people of this country. 1028 00:51:14,840 --> 00:51:17,380 So to get a little bit further along the road, 1029 00:51:17,500 --> 00:51:17,860 Mr. Kelly, 1030 00:51:17,980 --> 00:51:21,620 I want to know more about the type of relationship 1031 00:51:21,620 --> 00:51:24,020 that you have and have had 1032 00:51:24,020 --> 00:51:28,060 with RTE executives over the past number of years. 1033 00:51:28,180 --> 00:51:29,040 How would you describe it? 1034 00:51:29,180 --> 00:51:29,800 Would it be healthy? 1035 00:51:29,940 --> 00:51:30,740 Would it be... 1036 00:51:30,740 --> 00:51:32,180 It would always be healthy 1037 00:51:32,180 --> 00:51:33,880 and it would always be frank. 1038 00:51:34,240 --> 00:51:37,240 It's RTE's job to get the best deal they can. 1039 00:51:37,620 --> 00:51:40,180 It's my job to get the best deal that I can. 1040 00:51:40,340 --> 00:51:41,700 Would there be executives afraid of you? 1041 00:51:41,840 --> 00:51:42,240 Would you say? 1042 00:51:42,580 --> 00:51:43,700 How could you be afraid of me? 1043 00:51:44,160 --> 00:51:44,600 Like, honestly, 1044 00:51:44,820 --> 00:51:46,800 it's five foot six me. 1045 00:51:47,340 --> 00:51:48,780 No, and look, 1046 00:51:48,800 --> 00:51:49,580 over the last two weeks, 1047 00:51:49,660 --> 00:51:51,960 all sorts of pictures are painted. 1048 00:51:53,260 --> 00:51:56,100 But I'm here to work on behalf of my clients. 1049 00:51:56,100 --> 00:51:57,440 Did you ever threaten to sue RTE in the past? 1050 00:51:57,980 --> 00:51:58,380 Sue them? 1051 00:51:58,600 --> 00:51:58,780 Yeah. 1052 00:51:59,060 --> 00:51:59,280 No. 1053 00:51:59,680 --> 00:52:01,140 I'll fucking sue you. 1054 00:52:01,720 --> 00:52:03,480 I'll fucking sue you. 1055 00:52:03,540 --> 00:52:04,880 Surrounding Operation Transformation. 1056 00:52:05,080 --> 00:52:06,040 Oh, Operation Transformation. 1057 00:52:06,240 --> 00:52:09,800 That was an independent production company. 1058 00:52:09,920 --> 00:52:10,740 It wasn't RTE. 1059 00:52:10,900 --> 00:52:12,960 But did you pitch the idea to RTE first? 1060 00:52:13,200 --> 00:52:13,520 Yes. 1061 00:52:13,840 --> 00:52:16,420 And did you subsequently threaten the legal action? 1062 00:52:16,920 --> 00:52:17,180 No. 1063 00:52:19,220 --> 00:52:20,260 I, Lord Reston, 1064 00:52:20,540 --> 00:52:21,660 we worked with Gerry Ryan. 1065 00:52:22,340 --> 00:52:25,700 And Gerry Ryan's radio show figures, 1066 00:52:26,080 --> 00:52:28,200 the measure for radio figures is JNLR. 1067 00:52:28,740 --> 00:52:29,620 And when they go down, 1068 00:52:29,620 --> 00:52:31,140 and it's really people in, 1069 00:52:31,220 --> 00:52:31,620 I suppose, 1070 00:52:31,700 --> 00:52:32,080 radio land, 1071 00:52:32,120 --> 00:52:32,540 when they go down, 1072 00:52:32,600 --> 00:52:32,700 they go, 1073 00:52:32,740 --> 00:52:33,140 oh my goodness, 1074 00:52:33,200 --> 00:52:33,600 they're down, 1075 00:52:33,680 --> 00:52:34,240 and what do you do? 1076 00:52:34,600 --> 00:52:35,380 If they go down, 1077 00:52:35,760 --> 00:52:35,980 say, 1078 00:52:36,040 --> 00:52:38,360 two or three times over a 12-month period, 1079 00:52:38,640 --> 00:52:39,580 your job's under threat. 1080 00:52:40,080 --> 00:52:40,420 Like, 1081 00:52:40,480 --> 00:52:40,720 literally, 1082 00:52:41,020 --> 00:52:42,140 and you're an independent contractor. 1083 00:52:42,200 --> 00:52:43,440 You didn't threaten to sue them? 1084 00:52:43,760 --> 00:52:43,980 No, 1085 00:52:44,180 --> 00:52:44,360 no, 1086 00:52:44,360 --> 00:52:45,520 but what I did was, 1087 00:52:45,760 --> 00:52:48,220 we had come up with the idea of Operation Transformation for Gerry, 1088 00:52:48,800 --> 00:52:52,480 and an independent production company tried to say that it was their idea. 1089 00:52:52,980 --> 00:52:55,100 How did you settle the issue with RTE? 1090 00:52:55,320 --> 00:52:55,960 How did it finish? 1091 00:52:56,220 --> 00:52:58,160 We settled with the production company. 1092 00:52:58,640 --> 00:52:59,260 The production company? 1093 00:52:59,260 --> 00:52:59,420 Yeah, 1094 00:52:59,800 --> 00:53:02,380 because I think it's a wonderful program, 1095 00:53:02,740 --> 00:53:04,300 and I wanted it to be out on RTE. 1096 00:53:04,300 --> 00:53:04,800 How was the figure? 1097 00:53:05,480 --> 00:53:05,780 Oh, 1098 00:53:05,780 --> 00:53:07,080 it wasn't very much. 1099 00:53:07,160 --> 00:53:07,400 Okay, 1100 00:53:07,800 --> 00:53:08,140 was it, 1101 00:53:08,420 --> 00:53:08,640 I mean, 1102 00:53:08,660 --> 00:53:09,600 are we talking five figures, 1103 00:53:09,760 --> 00:53:10,180 are we talking? 1104 00:53:11,020 --> 00:53:11,700 It's not relevant. 1105 00:53:11,840 --> 00:53:12,320 Six figures? 1106 00:53:12,340 --> 00:53:12,580 It's not relevant. 1107 00:53:12,580 --> 00:53:13,140 I think it is, 1108 00:53:13,460 --> 00:53:14,300 because I want to establish, 1109 00:53:14,600 --> 00:53:16,500 what was the feeling around RTE, 1110 00:53:16,640 --> 00:53:17,420 when they're dealing with you, 1111 00:53:17,580 --> 00:53:19,000 that these are the types of things that can happen? 1112 00:53:21,860 --> 00:53:22,260 Yeah. 1113 00:53:23,420 --> 00:53:23,780 It's a, 1114 00:53:24,000 --> 00:53:25,840 there was a confidentiality agreement in it. 1115 00:53:26,200 --> 00:53:26,780 It is relevant, 1116 00:53:26,880 --> 00:53:27,000 though. 1117 00:53:27,560 --> 00:53:28,580 Could I just ask you, 1118 00:53:28,580 --> 00:53:30,820 That is a total and absolute lie. 1119 00:53:30,960 --> 00:53:32,640 The tripartite deal, 1120 00:53:32,820 --> 00:53:35,540 that had nothing to do with Ryan's new contract for TV and radio services, 1121 00:53:35,920 --> 00:53:36,760 and Reno were paying it, 1122 00:53:36,760 --> 00:53:39,260 so it was just a coincidence of timing, 1123 00:53:39,360 --> 00:53:39,740 is that right? 1124 00:53:40,140 --> 00:53:40,320 Yeah. 1125 00:53:40,740 --> 00:53:41,040 Okay. 1126 00:53:41,200 --> 00:53:41,820 And again, 1127 00:53:41,860 --> 00:53:43,180 it was instigated by RTE. 1128 00:53:43,200 --> 00:53:45,260 You can understand why people might find that hard to believe, 1129 00:53:45,400 --> 00:53:46,880 but it is coincidence that's happened. 1130 00:53:47,580 --> 00:53:49,020 On page five of the document packed today, 1131 00:53:49,120 --> 00:53:54,260 then it's clear that the 75,000 of guaranteed commercial income was baked in from the very start, 1132 00:53:54,340 --> 00:53:54,480 really, 1133 00:53:54,540 --> 00:53:54,940 wasn't it? 1134 00:53:55,260 --> 00:53:55,660 Again, 1135 00:53:55,760 --> 00:53:56,260 from RTE. 1136 00:53:56,720 --> 00:53:57,000 Okay. 1137 00:53:57,460 --> 00:54:03,640 So you're saying to me that they came up with this completely on their side only. 1138 00:54:03,820 --> 00:54:03,920 Yeah. 1139 00:54:03,920 --> 00:54:06,640 You never solicited anything of the sort. 1140 00:54:07,160 --> 00:54:07,340 No. 1141 00:54:07,680 --> 00:54:07,800 I mean, 1142 00:54:07,940 --> 00:54:09,880 Ryan had been doing the show for quite a while, 1143 00:54:10,380 --> 00:54:11,380 and I'm assuming, 1144 00:54:11,500 --> 00:54:12,900 when RTE wanted to do it, 1145 00:54:13,020 --> 00:54:16,240 I can only assume that they wanted to keep the sponsor locked in for the next five years, 1146 00:54:16,300 --> 00:54:18,080 so this be a way that they could actually do that. 1147 00:54:18,360 --> 00:54:18,540 Okay. 1148 00:54:18,900 --> 00:54:19,260 Ryan, 1149 00:54:19,340 --> 00:54:20,020 can I just ask you, 1150 00:54:20,280 --> 00:54:20,920 pre-2020, 1151 00:54:21,380 --> 00:54:23,760 were you doing things for Reno at that stage? 1152 00:54:24,420 --> 00:54:25,760 Official RTE spokesman, 1153 00:54:25,760 --> 00:54:26,500 thank you very much. 1154 00:54:26,500 --> 00:54:26,700 I'm not going to say that. 1155 00:54:26,700 --> 00:54:27,360 I'm not going to say that. 1156 00:54:27,360 --> 00:54:28,040 I'm not going to say that. 1157 00:54:28,040 --> 00:54:28,600 I don't think so. 1158 00:54:28,880 --> 00:54:29,160 Okay. 1159 00:54:30,800 --> 00:54:31,780 Could I just go back to you, 1160 00:54:31,820 --> 00:54:32,160 Mr Kelly, 1161 00:54:32,260 --> 00:54:32,420 then, 1162 00:54:32,500 --> 00:54:34,880 in relation to the VAT rate that you received for the services? 1163 00:54:35,040 --> 00:54:36,400 Was it a 0% VAT rate, 1164 00:54:37,040 --> 00:54:38,380 or was it 23%? 1165 00:54:38,480 --> 00:54:44,360 0% would be applicable to the UK, whereas 23% would be the rate if it was paid by RTE. 1166 00:54:45,000 --> 00:54:45,400 So... 1167 00:54:45,400 --> 00:54:49,640 Yes. Yes. Yes. Yes. 1168 00:54:50,300 --> 00:54:53,260 Whatever the applicable rate was that we were told to put on it by RTE. 1169 00:54:53,780 --> 00:54:55,840 So was it 0% or 23%? 1170 00:54:56,160 --> 00:54:57,460 I honestly... 1171 00:54:57,460 --> 00:54:58,360 Why did you say it? 1172 00:54:59,280 --> 00:55:00,120 Zero. Zero. 1173 00:55:00,120 --> 00:55:00,600 Zero. It's UK. 1174 00:55:00,760 --> 00:55:03,800 And could I just ask then as well, 1175 00:55:04,120 --> 00:55:10,640 could you explain to me, last week when Geraldine O'Leary was here, 1176 00:55:11,180 --> 00:55:14,700 in year two, quote, in year two, two weeks ago, I had no involvement. 1177 00:55:14,940 --> 00:55:15,600 There was no payment. 1178 00:55:15,720 --> 00:55:19,460 In year three, I was advised by the Director General that there was pressure to pay. 1179 00:55:20,020 --> 00:55:20,800 Thanks very much. 1180 00:55:21,100 --> 00:55:23,600 I did not understand at the time they were underwritten by RTE. 1181 00:55:23,600 --> 00:55:24,800 I played football with that. 1182 00:55:24,800 --> 00:55:27,900 I was asked to lead the Nodgallie Management to raise the invoices to the Barter account. 1183 00:55:28,480 --> 00:55:30,900 And there's reference to that then as well, that between the 13th, 1184 00:55:30,960 --> 00:55:34,720 in the Grand Thornton Report, 13th to the 29th of March, 2022, 1185 00:55:35,300 --> 00:55:39,400 communications between agents and Ryan Torbertoe chasing payment on foot 1186 00:55:39,400 --> 00:55:40,940 of the underwriting of the commercial agreement, 1187 00:55:41,400 --> 00:55:43,520 notwithstanding the ceasing of the tripartite agreement, 1188 00:55:43,680 --> 00:55:47,940 RT had a contractual obligation to make two payments of £75,000. 1189 00:55:48,800 --> 00:55:50,680 So who's telling... 1190 00:55:50,680 --> 00:55:52,220 Who's telling lies, lads? 1191 00:55:52,360 --> 00:55:53,300 Who's telling the truth? 1192 00:55:53,320 --> 00:55:54,940 Those versions of events are at odds with each other. 1193 00:55:54,940 --> 00:55:56,060 We want some... 1194 00:55:56,060 --> 00:55:58,620 You better fucking start telling them some answers, lads. 1195 00:55:58,620 --> 00:56:02,960 What we're told to you is that there was communications between yourselves and RT 1196 00:56:02,960 --> 00:56:05,580 about chasing up the £150,000. 1197 00:56:06,220 --> 00:56:11,860 Someone better fucking start talking to, lads. 1198 00:56:12,240 --> 00:56:12,640 Exactly. 1199 00:56:13,200 --> 00:56:16,060 I think it was funny that this... 1200 00:56:16,060 --> 00:56:19,360 Why would you go to RT for in-over the people who were supposed to be there? 1201 00:56:19,360 --> 00:56:22,420 Because we were asked to send the invoices to RTE. 1202 00:56:22,420 --> 00:56:24,300 Again, this was RTE. 1203 00:56:24,860 --> 00:56:28,180 Did you ever contact with anyone in Renault about the deal? 1204 00:56:28,580 --> 00:56:28,780 No. 1205 00:56:29,160 --> 00:56:33,020 Apart from the actual activation itself, what would we like to set up... 1206 00:56:33,020 --> 00:56:35,800 Did anyone in Renault tell you that they were no longer paying the money? 1207 00:56:36,040 --> 00:56:36,300 No. 1208 00:56:36,660 --> 00:56:36,860 No. 1209 00:56:37,100 --> 00:56:38,060 No one's calling in Renault? 1210 00:56:38,440 --> 00:56:38,540 No. 1211 00:56:38,540 --> 00:56:38,940 If I'm doing that. 1212 00:56:39,160 --> 00:56:39,900 No, Mr. Topperdy. 1213 00:56:40,760 --> 00:56:41,060 No one. 1214 00:56:41,640 --> 00:56:41,800 Okay. 1215 00:56:42,200 --> 00:56:42,700 What's that? 1216 00:56:43,200 --> 00:56:45,620 Something's just been slid across the desk there. 1217 00:56:46,300 --> 00:56:47,100 When they're called upon. 1218 00:56:47,500 --> 00:56:48,780 There'll be interesting events. 1219 00:56:49,240 --> 00:56:50,840 Well, we got the colour correction. 1220 00:56:50,880 --> 00:56:51,320 They're not called upon. 1221 00:56:51,320 --> 00:56:51,940 Colour correction. 1222 00:56:52,560 --> 00:56:53,260 And the opacity. 1223 00:56:53,520 --> 00:56:54,300 Money gets handed back. 1224 00:56:54,300 --> 00:56:57,760 Would you provide copies of correspondence in that period, January to March, 2022? 1225 00:56:57,760 --> 00:56:58,660 Let's close that up. 1226 00:56:59,660 --> 00:57:03,700 Of correspondence you had in terms of chasing up those invoices. 1227 00:57:06,380 --> 00:57:08,320 It's referred to here in the report. 1228 00:57:08,320 --> 00:57:11,740 And it's 2.17 of the Grant Thornton Review. 1229 00:57:12,400 --> 00:57:14,660 So the correspondence referred to their records. 1230 00:57:14,800 --> 00:57:16,700 Would you provide the committee with those details? 1231 00:57:16,700 --> 00:57:17,700 Yeah. 1232 00:57:19,460 --> 00:57:19,780 Sorry. 1233 00:57:20,060 --> 00:57:21,160 In page 25. 1234 00:57:24,220 --> 00:57:28,060 That's the email where they ask us to raise it. 1235 00:57:28,840 --> 00:57:30,220 Send it and send it in to them. 1236 00:57:30,980 --> 00:57:31,140 Yeah. 1237 00:57:31,780 --> 00:57:37,980 If RT never knew or hadn't dealt with CMS previously, how do they know to instruct you? 1238 00:57:38,740 --> 00:57:39,300 How about this? 1239 00:57:40,160 --> 00:57:40,420 Sorry. 1240 00:57:41,540 --> 00:57:42,940 Invices through it at that stage. 1241 00:57:43,320 --> 00:57:46,280 Because my email is at CMS. 1242 00:57:46,280 --> 00:57:47,980 We are CMS and NK. 1243 00:57:47,980 --> 00:57:49,880 So they just asked us to raise it that way. 1244 00:57:49,880 --> 00:57:54,800 Was that strange though when everything else previously would have been through NK and next thing to win? 1245 00:57:54,800 --> 00:57:57,240 I think there's a lot of things it seems. 1246 00:57:57,360 --> 00:57:58,280 Did you ask them? 1247 00:57:59,080 --> 00:57:59,920 But at the time, no. 1248 00:58:00,420 --> 00:58:01,680 Did you suggest it? 1249 00:58:02,040 --> 00:58:03,980 Did you suggest that it would go through CMS? 1250 00:58:04,380 --> 00:58:04,580 No. 1251 00:58:04,940 --> 00:58:05,120 No. 1252 00:58:05,320 --> 00:58:05,380 No. 1253 00:58:05,380 --> 00:58:05,460 No. 1254 00:58:05,640 --> 00:58:08,500 Because to have people looking in, this looks like another layer to try to cover up. 1255 00:58:08,640 --> 00:58:09,680 But I'm sorry, definitely. 1256 00:58:09,880 --> 00:58:11,780 We came here today to tell you everything we know. 1257 00:58:11,820 --> 00:58:11,940 Yeah. 1258 00:58:12,000 --> 00:58:12,980 And that's what I'm trying to do. 1259 00:58:13,020 --> 00:58:13,840 Well, I'm trying to ask you questions. 1260 00:58:13,840 --> 00:58:16,480 And there's absolutely no deception on our part. 1261 00:58:16,480 --> 00:58:17,740 Everything is factual. 1262 00:58:17,740 --> 00:58:23,580 And we've had our legal people work along with us with RTE on all contracts. 1263 00:58:24,180 --> 00:58:27,560 So you're saying no, you did not suggest that it would go through CMS at any stage? 1264 00:58:27,560 --> 00:58:28,080 No. 1265 00:58:28,080 --> 00:58:28,180 No. 1266 00:58:28,180 --> 00:58:28,180 No. 1267 00:58:28,180 --> 00:58:30,740 You were nobody working with you on your behalf? 1268 00:58:30,740 --> 00:58:30,920 No. 1269 00:58:31,280 --> 00:58:31,460 No. 1270 00:58:31,900 --> 00:58:32,740 You're confident of that? 1271 00:58:32,900 --> 00:58:33,540 100%. 1272 00:58:33,540 --> 00:58:41,140 Could I ask Mr. Toperty, just in relation to the Toy Show Live event, was there one pitched by... 1273 00:58:41,140 --> 00:58:43,260 No, it was never pitched as an idea. 1274 00:58:43,380 --> 00:58:43,480 No. 1275 00:58:43,800 --> 00:58:44,000 No. 1276 00:58:44,240 --> 00:58:44,520 Was it? 1277 00:58:44,620 --> 00:58:44,720 Sorry. 1278 00:58:44,840 --> 00:58:45,100 Was it pitched? 1279 00:58:45,120 --> 00:58:45,620 No, sorry. 1280 00:58:45,720 --> 00:58:46,040 It was. 1281 00:58:46,180 --> 00:58:46,480 It was. 1282 00:58:46,500 --> 00:58:46,860 My brother. 1283 00:58:47,080 --> 00:58:47,320 Sorry. 1284 00:58:47,480 --> 00:58:48,440 I've got to tell you that. 1285 00:58:48,740 --> 00:58:49,060 Sorry. 1286 00:58:49,060 --> 00:58:49,980 Sorry, that's... 1287 00:58:49,980 --> 00:58:55,820 Years ago, when the Toy Show was running, and the Toy Show was just such an institution, 1288 00:58:55,960 --> 00:59:00,360 there was some deals done with an RTE commercial with, I'm not sure who the clothing manufacturer 1289 00:59:00,360 --> 00:59:04,180 was with sort of jumpers and pajamas and stuff like that, you know, from further around the Toy Show. 1290 00:59:04,780 --> 00:59:11,200 And we said to them, just set them as an idea, what you should actually do is take it, the actual physical set, 1291 00:59:11,480 --> 00:59:14,900 take it somewhere like the RDS so people can see it and enjoy it, because obviously on the night... 1292 00:59:14,900 --> 00:59:17,120 And this was to have Mr. Toperty as to present... 1293 00:59:17,120 --> 00:59:18,260 No, this is nothing to do with Ryan. 1294 00:59:18,340 --> 00:59:21,640 This was to do with that you should actually take the set and show the set off. 1295 00:59:21,700 --> 00:59:25,280 If they were going to do something with the Toy Show, don't put it maybe on jumpers and pajamas, 1296 00:59:25,540 --> 00:59:27,860 actually take it out there and let people see it and what it was. 1297 00:59:27,860 --> 00:59:29,440 And Ryan, can I just ask you, when did you learn... 1298 00:59:29,440 --> 00:59:33,700 Have you learned that Jane Murphy and Catherine Droghan were planning the Toy Show, the musical? 1299 00:59:33,700 --> 00:59:36,880 Probably at the early stages they would have told me that they were planning this. 1300 00:59:36,880 --> 00:59:41,600 Okay, and did you have a dispute with them about this because of the Toy Show Alive event? 1301 00:59:41,600 --> 00:59:43,340 No, no, no, the Toy Show Alive never came to anything. 1302 00:59:43,480 --> 00:59:49,380 There's no point that they... the musical was a totally separate entity and they decided to... 1303 00:59:49,380 --> 00:59:53,380 They came up with it, a very ambitious thing to do and given the nature of my job, 1304 00:59:53,440 --> 00:59:56,880 there was no way I was going to be in a position to get involved. So I wish them... 1305 00:59:56,880 --> 00:59:59,700 Do you have any dispute with them about this or there was friction? 1306 00:59:59,700 --> 01:00:05,960 I thought, no, that this was a big ambitious project and another way to maybe... 1307 01:00:05,960 --> 01:00:15,740 I don't recall... I listen a lot to RT Radio. I don't recall a massive promotion on your part of Toy Show, the musical. 1308 01:00:15,960 --> 01:00:18,800 Well, that's because the ads did the talking. There were plenty of them. 1309 01:00:19,140 --> 01:00:22,580 You didn't have any guests on talking about it at any stage on the show? 1310 01:00:22,580 --> 01:00:27,240 There were multiple mentions, if I'm not mistaken, on the Late Late Show, yes. 1311 01:00:27,240 --> 01:00:28,400 On the Radio Show? 1312 01:00:30,500 --> 01:00:33,700 I can't recall, but it wasn't done out of any... 1313 01:00:33,700 --> 01:00:37,040 Were you asked at any point to promote it in reviews? 1314 01:00:37,040 --> 01:00:37,980 Would that happen? 1315 01:00:37,980 --> 01:00:39,800 No, I don't think I would be that. 1316 01:00:39,800 --> 01:00:40,580 I would be... 1317 01:00:40,580 --> 01:00:46,080 Were you reluctant? I can understand maybe why you might be reluctant to get involved with the brand because it looked like it was... 1318 01:00:46,080 --> 01:00:53,080 No, I wished... At any time I was asked about the musical, I always wished them well. I had no ill will towards it. 1319 01:00:53,080 --> 01:01:07,060 OK. Noel Kelly, could I just ask you again there, in relation to the Late Late Show, and look, it's a very... I mean, it has hundreds of thousands of viewers. It can be a very lucrative slot if you get an appearance there for someone who's launching a book or a film or whatever. 1320 01:01:08,260 --> 01:01:12,840 What is your role there in terms of influencing guest appearances on the Late Late Show? 1321 01:01:13,160 --> 01:01:13,360 None. 1322 01:01:13,820 --> 01:01:14,340 None whatsoever? 1323 01:01:14,520 --> 01:01:15,980 None, sure. That's all editorial. 1324 01:01:15,980 --> 01:01:20,980 Yeah, do you have any influence on that though? I mean, have you ever in the past asked to get someone on the Late Late Show? 1325 01:01:20,980 --> 01:01:22,980 No. Sure, apart from Ryan. 1326 01:01:22,980 --> 01:01:26,980 Apart from Ryan? Anyone else? Any of your clients? Have you ever... 1327 01:01:26,980 --> 01:01:27,980 No, it's editorial. 1328 01:01:27,980 --> 01:01:34,980 Can you see how you'd be conflicted with one of your clients being the presenter and you of other clients you represent, some of whom have appeared in the Late Late Show? 1329 01:01:34,980 --> 01:01:41,980 It's... Guests, I mean, everything else that's purely RTE, editorial, I'm sure I'd have nothing to do with that for... 1330 01:01:41,980 --> 01:01:52,980 How would you see your role in the future in the changing culture in RT? Would you see your position being under-thread in terms of where you'd slot in there? 1331 01:01:52,980 --> 01:01:56,980 We work with Netflix, we work with streamers, we work with all the new media... 1332 01:01:56,980 --> 01:01:59,980 Do you fuck? You don't work with me, man! 1333 01:01:59,980 --> 01:02:03,980 Get me a Renault cash strap, will you? 1334 01:02:03,980 --> 01:02:13,980 What I love doing is nurturing young talent and finding young talent and getting them book deals or maybe get them a TV show. That's what I love doing. So that's where I'd see myself. That's always where I've seen myself. You know? 1335 01:02:13,980 --> 01:02:20,980 Would you go through, when you get a chance, like we had two lengthy hearings last week, the media committee at the PSE have also had a hearing... 1336 01:02:20,980 --> 01:02:25,980 I need a Mercedes cash strap. There's a long summer there. I think it would be helpful if any other mistruths... 1337 01:02:25,980 --> 01:02:33,980 I want a Renault Cleo! I want 75k in kickbacks and I want it now! And I don't want to pay tax on it neither! 1338 01:02:33,980 --> 01:02:37,980 Would you bring those to our attention? I think it would be important to the committee if that would happen. 1339 01:02:37,980 --> 01:02:53,980 You know, in relation to mistruths, I'm not here in relation to what other people felt, see or saw. We're just in relation here to what we knew, what was contracted, what we had agreed. 1340 01:02:53,980 --> 01:03:00,980 And all I can talk about is all that I know. And not what other people said or do or think. And certainly after the last few weeks if I was to do that... 1341 01:03:00,980 --> 01:03:03,980 I have to conclude Deputy Rook's last question. 1342 01:03:03,980 --> 01:03:07,980 Yeah, so there's nothing else that was said last week that you were aware was untrue. 1343 01:03:07,980 --> 01:03:12,980 This guy has had a good run of questions now. They need to move on to Boyd Barrett. 1344 01:03:12,980 --> 01:03:23,980 Boyd Barrett is sharpening his knife as we speak. According to a couple of people there. 1345 01:03:23,980 --> 01:03:26,980 It's a key part of... No, I know, but I just want to say that... 1346 01:03:27,980 --> 01:03:30,980 Here's Ryan with the thanks again, the full thanks. 1347 01:03:30,980 --> 01:03:33,980 I understand. Thank you. Senator Warfield? 1348 01:03:33,980 --> 01:03:36,980 You're both very welcome here. Thank you. 1349 01:03:36,980 --> 01:03:45,980 A question just firstly for now, Kelly. What did you think when RTE asked for an invoice to be made out for consultancy fees? 1350 01:03:46,980 --> 01:03:47,980 When they asked... 1351 01:03:47,980 --> 01:03:51,980 Mamadoc, thank you very much. Again. Sorry, under instruction from RTE... 1352 01:03:51,980 --> 01:03:54,980 Mouldy Mike, thank you very much. It's RTE, it's this institution. And oh. 1353 01:03:54,980 --> 01:04:00,980 It's, you know, it's 100 years old, why would you question it? It's easy to say now, but at the time why would you, you know? 1354 01:04:00,980 --> 01:04:04,980 Yeah. And their instructions said, we're just a little company. 1355 01:04:04,980 --> 01:04:07,980 Solid snake, thank you very much. Is that Matty McGrath? 1356 01:04:07,980 --> 01:04:11,980 A terrible employment record in many respects. 1357 01:04:11,980 --> 01:04:15,980 I hope fucking Matty McGrath's saying something. That'll be beautiful. 1358 01:04:15,980 --> 01:04:20,980 500 workers potentially classed as self-employed when they should be employees. 1359 01:04:20,980 --> 01:04:26,980 60% of investigations have led to employees being reclassified as self-employed people. 1360 01:04:26,980 --> 01:04:32,980 It's a very softly spoken fella, this guy. They need to put, they need to get some fucking Rottweilers on them. 1361 01:04:32,980 --> 01:04:34,980 They can't have any... 1362 01:04:34,980 --> 01:04:35,980 But still, you think that... 1363 01:04:35,980 --> 01:04:39,980 They're giving it... We don't want these guys to have an easy ride here. 1364 01:04:39,980 --> 01:04:44,980 ...about RTE and how they might behave around staff. 1365 01:04:44,980 --> 01:04:50,980 I suppose, look, I'm 60, I've been brought up with RTE, listening to RTE radio, watching, you know, RTE. 1366 01:04:50,980 --> 01:04:54,980 We went to be... Ryan did a good bit of work with BBC. 1367 01:04:54,980 --> 01:04:55,980 Another adapter there. 1368 01:04:55,980 --> 01:04:56,980 I was expecting... 1369 01:04:56,980 --> 01:04:57,980 The double adapter. 1370 01:04:57,980 --> 01:05:17,980 ...be blown away by, oh my God, this is going to be incredible. It wasn't that. As in, RTE is a fantastic organisation. Great people, great producers, directors, form managers, people, perception. It's an amazing organisation. Fabulous people. And I want RTE to win. I want RTE to win. But also there's the commercial. There's a fantastic commercial sector here in Ireland. 1371 01:05:17,980 --> 01:05:24,980 News Talk Today FM, you know, Midlands Radio. And they survive purely on commercial revenue. You know, purely. 1372 01:05:24,980 --> 01:05:33,980 Can I ask you about the sector as a whole? You represent a number of high profile personalities. You don't be asking them, can I ask it, can I ask it. Just ask them. Go straight in. 1373 01:05:33,980 --> 01:05:47,980 ...and rival media organisations as well. You know what a lot of people are earning in our sector, in the media sector. So you can go to RTE and say, one of my clients wants a pay rise. They might say no. 1374 01:05:47,980 --> 01:06:16,100 Ivan Yates' Renault Lounge. Thank you very much for the tip. And what an amazing image that conjures up in my mind. The Ivan Yates' Renault Lounge. Imagine that at Electric Picnic. It's going to kick back on a Saturday or Sunday, you know, just for a nice kind of chill out. Just to collect yourself after a hectic kind of Friday, Saturday. Then it's kind of the come down Renault Lounge with Ivan Yates on Sunday. 1375 01:06:16,100 --> 01:06:38,940 Quite a dominant role in setting remuneration across the sector. So to that end, there's more people being paid more money in the commercial sector than in RTE. Higher salaries. Purely because everything is based on commercial, JNL or the right figures. So if you're hitting the right figures, then they're getting the right advertising. 1376 01:06:38,940 --> 01:06:45,940 It's a secret wink again there. So RTE is a hybrid. RTE has... Do you have a monopoly though? What? Do you have a monopoly? What? As an agent. 1377 01:06:45,940 --> 01:06:55,560 Like a monopoly isn't commercial. Commercial is... You've peddled your lies all over the world. People are paid more commercial because the value is... They know what the true value is. But you know... What happens? 1378 01:06:55,820 --> 01:07:07,780 Nintendo's Game Boy. Going for the same job. The best one gets it. Surely you have to back... No, no, no. For want of a better word. No. I don't want to describe anyone. No, no. You have to back someone. 1379 01:07:07,780 --> 01:07:15,760 If you think about it, when Pat gave up the Late Late Show. Excuse me, Jerry went to the... A bit of a burp there. You see that again. 1380 01:07:17,400 --> 01:07:33,020 From that end, I know at the time. But from that... From that... From that... From that... It's like... It's like any job, you know. The number of people can interview you, but they decide in the end to actually get the job. But from that... From that... From that end, I know at the time... Were you only 35 when you got the Late Late Show? 1381 01:07:34,080 --> 01:07:41,240 Yeah. I think so. About 35. It was all about a younger demographic. That's what they were... Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. 1382 01:07:42,240 --> 01:07:51,080 Wanted to bring... Try and bring in younger people. And as a result, that muddies the market for all the other local radio stations, national radio stations, TV stations... 1383 01:07:51,080 --> 01:08:01,080 Yeah. The... The... Fucking... Aroctis player... I wanted to go back and see his burp lies there. Somebody was saying in the chat that they were... They were lie burps. Says boom, boom, 43. 1384 01:08:01,240 --> 01:08:09,740 I wanted to go back and replay Noel Kelly's lie burps. But the fucking shoddy player, Aroctis player, wouldn't let me skip back. 1385 01:08:10,040 --> 01:08:15,160 Yeah. I could say that. I mean, it helps if I want to write a book about John F. Kennedy or about... Yeah. 1386 01:08:15,240 --> 01:08:20,760 A multicoloured sheep. Both of which I've written about for different reasons. I can do that as an independent contractor. 1387 01:08:20,760 --> 01:08:26,480 And you say there's nothing morally, ethically or legally wrong with that. Mm. Um... Is it fair? 1388 01:08:26,480 --> 01:08:37,820 A Google user. Thanks for the tip. Uh-huh. A multicoloured sheep. There's a benefit. It... The benefit comes from your connection with RTE. 1389 01:08:39,520 --> 01:08:50,440 Mm. I'd like to think that it's... It's broad. That... That the... The appeal is... Is not just the appeal. I mean... You've been there since the age of... 1390 01:08:50,440 --> 01:09:01,580 You've been there since the age of 12. Yeah, I have. I have. I have. I have. But if Harper Collins asked me to write a history book, does it matter that I work in RTE? I don't know. That's for them to answer. I don't want to overstate my value to somewhere. 1391 01:09:02,580 --> 01:09:18,060 In your open statement today, and a number of times this morning at PAC, you say that you took a pay cut, and I think to most people out there, a pay cut is where you work the same hours and conditions for less pay. 1392 01:09:18,060 --> 01:09:41,860 But that's not the case here. In contract negotiations in very well known, they state that reduce fees has to reflect the reduced levels of services. It has to reflect the reduced levels of services. So it's in the terms. That means that if you get paid less, there would be less money. 1393 01:09:42,580 --> 01:10:09,780 Lots of kickbacks for you and me. Keep stum, and nobody will get done. Bring it back again. From 2000 to 40%. And again, in relation to Ireland, the late late show, the late late show, it's half line to half 11. It's supposed to be the arts half line to half 11, right? 1394 01:10:11,100 --> 01:10:35,380 I mean, extra. So I believe the new late late shows, I believe the new late late shows, 30 shows of an hour and a half. What did they know? What did they know? What does it do? So every 15 minutes or 20 minutes is an extra ad slot for ads. You know, so in the new world, if it finishes at 11 o'clock, it's a different value. To the commercial. 1395 01:10:35,380 --> 01:11:02,080 So over the period of those six years, there was a 40% pay cut. The contract went from 545 to 440. And over those six years, the commercial revenue, and I'm talking about the commercial part, the commercial revenue to RTE, between the late late show, advertising, sponsorship, text 12345 for the viewers' prize, the radio show, was 100 million euros over six years. 1396 01:11:02,080 --> 01:11:15,360 So, you know, it's a very demanding schedule. Like, you're 38 weeks, you can't take any time, you've made a radio, then you've got that. So now a little bit of time off during the summer. I know it's a lot of money. And it's not about the amount of money. 1397 01:11:15,920 --> 01:11:35,020 And Ryan said to himself, after COVID, he left himself on the floor. And he was turning 50, time to do all this stuff. And as an independent contractor, he'd be paid, you know, less than half to do radio. But he can do a famine documentary, he can write another work. He just wants to change his life. It's time for him to change. 1398 01:11:35,220 --> 01:11:40,220 Why do you not discuss your years with St. Joseph's spy scout movement? 1399 01:11:40,580 --> 01:11:42,620 My time is almost up. Pardon me? 1400 01:11:42,820 --> 01:11:43,880 My time is almost up. 1401 01:11:44,060 --> 01:11:48,800 Yeah, sorry. I was about to elucidate on the joys of leaving the late late show, but I won't do that now, obviously. 1402 01:11:48,900 --> 01:11:58,140 I've just, on the issue of the late late show, throughout the documentation that you sent us, often you used the term late late toy show live. 1403 01:11:58,320 --> 01:11:58,680 Yes. 1404 01:11:59,040 --> 01:12:04,800 And late late toy show interchangeably. Punished. I'm just, at no point for talking about the music. 1405 01:12:04,800 --> 01:12:06,960 Thank you very much. Crashed the reno. Thank you very much. 1406 01:12:06,960 --> 01:12:13,480 We had never any talks about the musical at all. At all. And it was never something that. 1407 01:12:13,660 --> 01:12:14,580 No, I didn't care. No. 1408 01:12:15,260 --> 01:12:19,880 Is there a separate agreement? Is there a separate commercial agreement in relation to the toy show? 1409 01:12:20,460 --> 01:12:21,500 The toy show. The toy show itself. 1410 01:12:21,500 --> 01:12:23,560 No, that's part of my contract. 1411 01:12:24,380 --> 01:12:28,780 Can I suggest something to you, just in the last four seconds that you have on your time? 1412 01:12:28,840 --> 01:12:29,180 Go on. 1413 01:12:29,720 --> 01:12:33,760 And maybe this is to the committee and to all the members of this particular committee. 1414 01:12:34,380 --> 01:12:39,480 I mean, in the event that I do keep my job, and it's touch and go from my understanding of it at the moment, 1415 01:12:41,040 --> 01:12:52,480 you know, I'd be happy to suggest that in the future we'd have a situation where you would publish my contract on an annual basis. 1416 01:12:52,980 --> 01:13:03,580 You know, with a few, obviously, for redactions for personnel or what have you, with the money and the salary and the earnings there, straight up. 1417 01:13:04,280 --> 01:13:08,040 Like, if RT are going through a cathartic week, let this be part of it. 1418 01:13:08,540 --> 01:13:14,060 I will offer that. I mean, I have nothing to hide. Put the contract out. Put it online. Tell everyone how much I have. 1419 01:13:14,180 --> 01:13:19,840 Don't wait for three years and then have this codology that can happen all this time later, despite us saying it at the time. 1420 01:13:20,180 --> 01:13:23,860 So, I hope that's of use to you, but I'm happy to offer that today. 1421 01:13:23,980 --> 01:13:26,600 Just a final question. You're fine. Okay. 1422 01:13:27,240 --> 01:13:34,660 Colleagues and witnesses, I'm obviously mindful of the fact that we're at the halfway mark, but we actually haven't met the halfway mark in terms of colleagues. 1423 01:13:35,120 --> 01:13:36,700 Senator Malcolm Byrne is next. 1424 01:13:37,360 --> 01:13:39,920 Are you able to go on for one more witness or do you mind your brain? 1425 01:13:39,920 --> 01:13:41,740 Delighted to talk to Senator Byrne, of course. 1426 01:13:41,760 --> 01:13:42,540 Okay, we'll continue. 1427 01:13:42,540 --> 01:13:43,140 Are you okay with that? 1428 01:13:43,260 --> 01:13:43,520 Yeah, yeah. 1429 01:13:43,520 --> 01:13:44,320 Is that okay with everything? 1430 01:13:44,320 --> 01:13:45,200 Are you okay, Senator? 1431 01:13:45,360 --> 01:13:45,480 Yeah. 1432 01:13:45,780 --> 01:13:49,740 Okay, and when Senator Byrne's finished, we'll recess for 10 minutes and then back again. 1433 01:13:49,740 --> 01:13:50,760 I appreciate that. Thank you. 1434 01:13:50,760 --> 01:13:54,180 Okay, I want to thank you, Chair, and I want to thank the witnesses. 1435 01:13:55,640 --> 01:14:18,540 Ryan, I think it's fair to say you and I know each other a long time. We were in UCD together. We were friendly at the time. I know how committed you are to radio. I know even back then you were deeply committed to broadcasting. And I think there is a passion that is there. And I think everybody recognizes your talents. And obviously this is having a big personal impact on you. 1436 01:14:18,560 --> 01:14:19,060 Yes, it is. 1437 01:14:19,420 --> 01:14:30,440 But I think, you know, it is important for us and I think for you that we get the full picture here. It's, as colleagues said, it's not about a witch hunt. This is about getting a full picture. 1438 01:14:30,540 --> 01:14:31,120 I understand that. 1439 01:14:31,300 --> 01:14:37,240 And I think what is emerging really is around a culture that exists within RT that's going to have to change. 1440 01:14:37,360 --> 01:14:37,500 Yes. 1441 01:14:37,680 --> 01:14:43,980 So my first question to you is, and it's very simple, do you believe in all of this that you have done anything wrong? 1442 01:14:44,200 --> 01:14:56,440 I think that the only thing that I can answer that in a way that's reasonable and fair is to say that I should have called out the figures when they were released all in one day on March. 1443 01:14:56,760 --> 01:15:07,480 I'm sorry, on January the 20th, 2021. They were wrong. We had requested that they change them before in dispatches. But that day we didn't. 1444 01:15:07,600 --> 01:15:10,280 So, yeah, I'm not without blame in that regard, of course. 1445 01:15:11,020 --> 01:15:22,620 Okay. I want to reflect on, and I suppose this is, after RT released its initial statement, both yourself and Mr. Kelly released a first statement on the Thursday. 1446 01:15:22,940 --> 01:15:29,020 And that was then followed by a second statement on the Friday, which was quite different, which actually acknowledged the problem. 1447 01:15:29,160 --> 01:15:39,460 Yeah, I can explain that if you wish. So what happened was, we were given approximately 30 minutes warning from RT to say this bomb is about to be let off. 1448 01:15:39,960 --> 01:15:50,000 And we looked at it and said, well, you can't, because you're putting out all this information, so much of which we can counter and clarify for you. 1449 01:15:50,760 --> 01:16:01,560 And it was, it was, it was, it was, and we said, maybe, you know, it's saying this report, the grand fortune report saying Ryan Tupperly did nothing wrong and all of this. 1450 01:16:01,560 --> 01:16:06,180 And we said, you've got to include that. And they said, no. 1451 01:16:07,040 --> 01:16:09,600 So we're releasing the statement. We said, the rush. 1452 01:16:10,700 --> 01:16:17,700 So, our statement, the first, the one you're referring to, went out saying we can't shed any light because we couldn't. 1453 01:16:18,740 --> 01:16:23,020 Then that night was an all-nighter. We looked through and everything and said, actually, do you know what? 1454 01:16:23,340 --> 01:16:27,720 I want to apologise to people because I should have called that out there as soon as I had the chance to, and I did. 1455 01:16:28,040 --> 01:16:32,900 And then, sorry to, and then, then the media maul. 1456 01:16:33,200 --> 01:16:37,620 Now, the media are brilliant. They're my colleagues and some of them are my friends, so I'm not, I'm not having to go with the media. 1457 01:16:37,620 --> 01:16:42,880 They're doing the job. I get that. But I'm just saying that there was a mauling of sorts, right, for three weeks. 1458 01:16:43,760 --> 01:16:48,780 And that's why we get to today where we've tried, like, we've put this together with a view to be transparent. 1459 01:16:49,140 --> 01:16:54,680 Let me come back to the question. Why, why do you think your salary was understated? I mean, you know. 1460 01:16:54,940 --> 01:16:55,880 You are a liar. 1461 01:16:56,040 --> 01:16:59,000 People know what their salaries are. You know what your salary is. People in RT. 1462 01:16:59,220 --> 01:17:02,420 Why, why do you think those figures were understated? 1463 01:17:03,320 --> 01:17:08,420 Again, it was a mistake on RT's part because we'd written to them and say, said, this is wrong. 1464 01:17:09,160 --> 01:17:10,880 And they said, sorry. 1465 01:17:11,380 --> 01:17:15,360 Well, no, what happened, not only that, but we also, there was an assumption. 1466 01:17:15,880 --> 01:17:17,880 We had said before, that's this. 1467 01:17:18,240 --> 01:17:19,160 Well, who's going to ask? 1468 01:17:19,420 --> 01:17:21,500 Just to finish, very brief, sorry, Senator. 1469 01:17:22,620 --> 01:17:29,140 And there was this assumption that here's an organisation that has, you know, CFO, internal auditors, etc. 1470 01:17:29,680 --> 01:17:33,160 But not only that, the figures have been externally audited and so on. 1471 01:17:33,440 --> 01:17:37,260 So you have an assumption, naive as it may be, that they have their reasons. 1472 01:17:37,260 --> 01:17:41,000 Who do you think is responsible, therefore, for the incorrect figures being issued? 1473 01:17:41,680 --> 01:17:43,360 Without question, RT. 1474 01:17:43,880 --> 01:17:44,880 But who in RT? 1475 01:17:45,060 --> 01:17:46,040 Oh, that's no, I'll tell you. 1476 01:17:46,180 --> 01:17:48,980 I mean, I'm sorry, that's the granular detail I don't. 1477 01:17:48,980 --> 01:17:52,540 I believe is responsible for misstating your client's salary figures. 1478 01:17:52,960 --> 01:17:57,900 We had done the contract and, again, always in, or the main term. 1479 01:17:57,900 --> 01:18:00,020 Well, who did you complain to? 1480 01:18:00,180 --> 01:18:01,080 You said you complained. 1481 01:18:01,080 --> 01:18:05,700 Oh, yeah, the letter to say, to explain to them that you're uncomfortable with the way they were shown. 1482 01:18:05,880 --> 01:18:07,860 Because these figures are discussed widely. 1483 01:18:07,860 --> 01:18:09,340 The document's in your... 1484 01:18:09,340 --> 01:18:10,400 Page 14. 1485 01:18:10,600 --> 01:18:10,740 Yeah. 1486 01:18:10,840 --> 01:18:11,120 Okay. 1487 01:18:11,240 --> 01:18:11,820 In the document. 1488 01:18:11,960 --> 01:18:13,120 That should clarify that for you. 1489 01:18:15,480 --> 01:18:17,580 Essentially made changes to the side, etc. 1490 01:18:17,900 --> 01:18:25,280 So then on the side letter, we asked them to take out all of this because they were trying 1491 01:18:25,280 --> 01:18:28,400 to offset a payment that you didn't take or invoice. 1492 01:18:28,480 --> 01:18:29,900 So this is the 120,000. 1493 01:18:30,160 --> 01:18:33,080 So Ryan never took and never invoiced first. 1494 01:18:33,240 --> 01:18:34,760 And they said they've got to offset it. 1495 01:18:34,880 --> 01:18:35,960 It's an accountancy thing. 1496 01:18:36,200 --> 01:18:37,560 So you're going, well, if it's not... 1497 01:18:37,560 --> 01:18:39,000 If it's... 1498 01:18:39,000 --> 01:18:41,500 For what I thought is if it's not there, how can it be there? 1499 01:18:41,500 --> 01:18:42,680 But they were trying to... 1500 01:18:42,680 --> 01:18:49,840 So that 120,000 then was offset against 17, 18 and 19 by RTE. 1501 01:18:50,140 --> 01:18:50,960 We wrote to them. 1502 01:18:52,180 --> 01:18:52,720 And in it... 1503 01:18:52,720 --> 01:18:54,520 And you never received that 120? 1504 01:18:54,980 --> 01:18:55,220 No. 1505 01:18:55,380 --> 01:18:56,200 So am I correct? 1506 01:18:56,320 --> 01:18:57,180 Can I just then... 1507 01:18:57,180 --> 01:18:58,820 So the declared figures... 1508 01:18:58,820 --> 01:18:59,060 Yes. 1509 01:18:59,140 --> 01:19:01,080 ...that were published at the time, right? 1510 01:19:01,660 --> 01:19:05,060 Were for 2017, 491,667. 1511 01:19:05,560 --> 01:19:07,980 2018, 495,000. 1512 01:19:07,980 --> 01:19:08,100 Yeah. 1513 01:19:08,480 --> 01:19:10,520 And 2019, 495,000. 1514 01:19:10,720 --> 01:19:10,720 Sure. 1515 01:19:10,920 --> 01:19:14,300 Those are the correct total figures that were paid by RTE to total. 1516 01:19:14,420 --> 01:19:15,360 No, they... 1517 01:19:15,360 --> 01:19:16,640 So that should have been... 1518 01:19:16,640 --> 01:19:18,340 You are on the fucking roll to see that now. 1519 01:19:18,360 --> 01:19:20,760 595, 545, 545, 545, 545. 1520 01:19:21,120 --> 01:19:21,380 Okay. 1521 01:19:21,440 --> 01:19:27,300 So what happened was they had put a figure that we have an invoice taken or given against those figures. 1522 01:19:27,460 --> 01:19:29,020 So it was an underpayment. 1523 01:19:29,020 --> 01:19:30,520 I'm just saying, Mr. Kelly, I appreciate that. 1524 01:19:30,720 --> 01:19:34,360 But I'm looking at the way a normal person looks at their annual salary. 1525 01:19:34,480 --> 01:19:34,940 So am I. 1526 01:19:34,940 --> 01:19:37,480 And this is a challenge. 1527 01:19:37,740 --> 01:19:40,700 And I mean, you know, there is a question that is here. 1528 01:19:40,700 --> 01:19:45,280 That people are looking and they're saying, hang on, we talked about it. 1529 01:19:45,340 --> 01:19:47,340 You know, everyone talks about the salaries when they're published. 1530 01:19:47,480 --> 01:19:47,620 Yeah. 1531 01:19:47,880 --> 01:19:48,500 Look at that tie. 1532 01:19:48,500 --> 01:19:50,800 And you knew even just to take one year, 229... 1533 01:19:50,800 --> 01:19:51,680 It's a great tie. 1534 01:19:51,820 --> 01:19:52,900 It was declared... 1535 01:19:52,900 --> 01:19:53,880 It's a fucking lovely tie. 1536 01:19:54,220 --> 01:19:56,680 ...declared before the Iraq this year, 495,000. 1537 01:19:56,820 --> 01:19:57,080 Sure. 1538 01:19:57,080 --> 01:20:02,420 Yet you knew that total is the company was paid 545,000. 1539 01:20:02,420 --> 01:20:02,740 That's right. 1540 01:20:02,900 --> 01:20:03,040 Correct. 1541 01:20:03,380 --> 01:20:05,560 That's the sound I hear when I see that tie. 1542 01:20:05,660 --> 01:20:06,260 I'm conscious on time. 1543 01:20:06,680 --> 01:20:08,120 Ryan, you mentioned that... 1544 01:20:08,120 --> 01:20:10,320 Sorry, can I just say on that final page there, 1545 01:20:10,320 --> 01:20:16,280 on page 17, they accepted that it was wrong. 1546 01:20:16,800 --> 01:20:22,000 I know, but for us and for the wider public, we didn't know. 1547 01:20:22,180 --> 01:20:23,460 And this is the problem. 1548 01:20:23,700 --> 01:20:23,800 Okay. 1549 01:20:24,300 --> 01:20:26,320 So, Ryan, you've said that you're going to... 1550 01:20:27,260 --> 01:20:29,500 If the gigs don't happen, if the Renault gigs don't happen, 1551 01:20:29,800 --> 01:20:30,740 you're going to pay them back. 1552 01:20:30,740 --> 01:20:31,280 The Renault gigs. 1553 01:20:31,600 --> 01:20:32,940 To whom are you going to pay it back? 1554 01:20:33,280 --> 01:20:34,820 I'd like a few Renault gigs. 1555 01:20:34,820 --> 01:20:37,760 Any Renault gigs going? 1556 01:20:38,960 --> 01:20:39,760 Paid the last two. 1557 01:20:39,980 --> 01:20:45,960 So, does the cheque or the bank transfer go to pay Astus Limited? 1558 01:20:46,280 --> 01:20:46,740 It's a good question. 1559 01:20:46,840 --> 01:20:47,280 Or pay Renault? 1560 01:20:47,620 --> 01:20:48,560 It's a great question. 1561 01:20:48,560 --> 01:20:48,740 Or pay RTE? 1562 01:20:49,460 --> 01:20:49,960 It's a good question. 1563 01:20:49,960 --> 01:20:50,800 Whoever paid it. 1564 01:20:50,800 --> 01:20:51,300 So, if it's Astus. 1565 01:20:51,300 --> 01:20:53,360 So, who do you think you're paying it to? 1566 01:20:53,360 --> 01:20:54,920 I think the answer is Astus, which to me, 1567 01:20:55,020 --> 01:20:57,680 as a result of the discoveries in the last week or two, 1568 01:20:57,820 --> 01:20:58,860 is RTE. 1569 01:20:59,500 --> 01:21:00,840 Now it's RTE. 1570 01:21:00,980 --> 01:21:01,760 So, it goes back to RTE. 1571 01:21:02,000 --> 01:21:03,360 So, it goes back to... 1572 01:21:03,360 --> 01:21:04,440 Through this desire. 1573 01:21:05,160 --> 01:21:05,500 Okay. 1574 01:21:06,600 --> 01:21:07,500 I'm still... 1575 01:21:07,500 --> 01:21:08,500 So, we knew... 1576 01:21:08,500 --> 01:21:10,620 And I want to come to you, Mr. Kelly. 1577 01:21:11,420 --> 01:21:12,900 And, you know, you're... 1578 01:21:12,900 --> 01:21:14,820 Obviously, you're a very experienced negotiator. 1579 01:21:14,920 --> 01:21:17,500 We know this in terms of those who you represent. 1580 01:21:17,740 --> 01:21:19,880 And I asked the questions, you know, 1581 01:21:19,960 --> 01:21:23,400 when the executive were in here as to, you know, 1582 01:21:23,440 --> 01:21:24,640 who was in the room with you. 1583 01:21:24,720 --> 01:21:27,560 And then you kindly, to some of our colleagues earlier today, 1584 01:21:27,640 --> 01:21:31,680 outlined, you know, who you had been dealing with. 1585 01:21:31,820 --> 01:21:35,140 One of the key people who very clearly knew about some of the deals 1586 01:21:35,140 --> 01:21:36,460 was Jim Jennings. 1587 01:21:36,820 --> 01:21:37,380 So, is it fair to say... 1588 01:21:37,380 --> 01:21:39,060 Rob and Tobas, thank you very much. 1589 01:21:39,080 --> 01:21:40,180 Would have been the individual... 1590 01:21:40,180 --> 01:21:40,820 Telly Toby. 1591 01:21:40,900 --> 01:21:42,080 ...who told the deal together with RTE. 1592 01:21:42,480 --> 01:21:43,220 Telly Toberty. 1593 01:21:43,380 --> 01:21:43,640 Sorry. 1594 01:21:44,080 --> 01:21:47,080 No, the commercial would have been done with... 1595 01:21:47,620 --> 01:21:50,880 Initially, with the lawyers when we were informed 1596 01:21:50,880 --> 01:21:51,920 that they wanted to do it. 1597 01:21:52,180 --> 01:21:53,460 And then it's handed over to commercial. 1598 01:21:53,680 --> 01:21:55,960 I appreciate that the lawyers would have done it. 1599 01:21:56,060 --> 01:21:59,580 But lawyers don't go out and sort of cut the deal. 1600 01:21:59,820 --> 01:22:02,080 You know, lawyers are the ones who sign up the deal. 1601 01:22:02,240 --> 01:22:02,800 I just... 1602 01:22:02,800 --> 01:22:03,460 It was... 1603 01:22:03,460 --> 01:22:08,080 I got this email on the 10th of March 2020. 1604 01:22:10,220 --> 01:22:10,660 Sorry. 1605 01:22:11,980 --> 01:22:13,220 Sorry, page number 14. 1606 01:22:13,400 --> 01:22:14,060 Sorry, number 14. 1607 01:22:14,060 --> 01:22:17,260 I attach for your attention the draft contract 1608 01:22:17,260 --> 01:22:18,880 that the two side letters discussed and agreed 1609 01:22:18,880 --> 01:22:20,020 in relation to this matter. 1610 01:22:20,520 --> 01:22:22,240 The sponsorship agreement will be handled 1611 01:22:22,240 --> 01:22:23,460 by our commercial team 1612 01:22:23,460 --> 01:22:27,780 and will be agreed separately to these documents. 1613 01:22:28,160 --> 01:22:31,700 So, you were negotiating at the time of the 2020 contract. 1614 01:22:31,800 --> 01:22:32,080 Yes. 1615 01:22:32,240 --> 01:22:32,440 OK. 1616 01:22:33,720 --> 01:22:36,460 And at the time, everyone in RTE was accepting, 1617 01:22:36,700 --> 01:22:37,860 you know, that there were going to be cuts. 1618 01:22:38,000 --> 01:22:38,220 Sure. 1619 01:22:38,340 --> 01:22:41,920 And we know how difficult the situation that it was. 1620 01:22:42,420 --> 01:22:46,300 What you're asking us to believe is that, you know, 1621 01:22:46,500 --> 01:22:49,540 Ryan could go off and he could negotiate his book deal 1622 01:22:49,540 --> 01:22:52,660 or he could negotiate his documentary separately as a contractor. 1623 01:22:53,100 --> 01:22:53,420 The note... 1624 01:22:53,420 --> 01:22:55,740 In this instance, what you're saying to us is... 1625 01:22:55,740 --> 01:23:00,700 The note says Nando's or Pizza Express, says Mr. Huxable there. 1626 01:23:00,700 --> 01:23:02,940 Somebody in RTE just came to you and said, 1627 01:23:03,060 --> 01:23:08,960 Noel, listen, we're going to offer a deal now with Renault. 1628 01:23:09,700 --> 01:23:11,060 Here's the deal. 1629 01:23:11,660 --> 01:23:14,480 Who was it that sort of said we're going to sort this out? 1630 01:23:14,480 --> 01:23:18,380 NK Ultra throwing his toy man out of the pram. 1631 01:23:19,480 --> 01:23:21,060 Yeah, from Breed O'Keefe. 1632 01:23:21,760 --> 01:23:22,860 Because, again... 1633 01:23:22,860 --> 01:23:25,440 So, was it Breed that struck the deal? 1634 01:23:26,240 --> 01:23:30,020 The deal with Renault and RT is completely between them. 1635 01:23:30,800 --> 01:23:33,600 I appreciate it, no, but you knew who, like... 1636 01:23:33,600 --> 01:23:36,920 You knew who this deal was on behalf of. 1637 01:23:37,400 --> 01:23:38,200 Sure, Renault and RT. 1638 01:23:38,560 --> 01:23:38,860 Yeah, yeah. 1639 01:23:38,860 --> 01:23:39,800 Get the hack going again. 1640 01:23:39,820 --> 01:23:43,520 RT was coming, you know, to Ryan. 1641 01:23:43,720 --> 01:23:45,140 Ryan was facing a pay cut. 1642 01:23:46,320 --> 01:23:48,580 Why, for instance, did you not go off and... 1643 01:23:48,580 --> 01:23:49,180 Sorry, sorry, no. 1644 01:23:49,220 --> 01:23:50,540 It wasn't that Ryan was facing a pay cut. 1645 01:23:51,300 --> 01:23:54,460 Ryan had given back 525,000. 1646 01:23:54,600 --> 01:23:55,700 Not that he was facing a pay cut. 1647 01:23:55,760 --> 01:23:59,160 He'd actually given back 525,000. 1648 01:23:59,300 --> 01:24:00,600 And he didn't take the 120,000. 1649 01:24:00,720 --> 01:24:02,680 So, it wasn't about pay cuts. 1650 01:24:02,800 --> 01:24:04,920 It was just a commercial, a separate commercial arrangement. 1651 01:24:05,360 --> 01:24:06,240 Separate commercial arrangement. 1652 01:24:06,260 --> 01:24:10,260 Okay, but why would you not have gone and negotiated directly with Renault? 1653 01:24:10,320 --> 01:24:11,500 Because we've got a relationship with Renault. 1654 01:24:11,720 --> 01:24:14,760 The relationship with the sponsor and RT is... 1655 01:24:15,460 --> 01:24:18,580 That's their relationship. 1656 01:24:18,720 --> 01:24:19,640 That's nothing to do with us. 1657 01:24:19,720 --> 01:24:20,520 We have nothing to do with... 1658 01:24:20,520 --> 01:24:22,400 And it's minded, obviously, because it's such a... 1659 01:24:22,400 --> 01:24:25,740 And did you not find it odd... 1660 01:24:25,740 --> 01:24:26,740 That we were in this period... 1661 01:24:27,420 --> 01:24:29,400 And colleagues have already talked about it. 1662 01:24:29,480 --> 01:24:34,080 You know, coming into COVID, there were pay cuts going on in RTE. 1663 01:24:34,840 --> 01:24:40,460 And suddenly, RTE were able to come with a deal to you and say, 1664 01:24:40,920 --> 01:24:49,300 Hey, we can mitigate some of this loss by you agreeing to go and do these gigs with Renault. 1665 01:24:49,300 --> 01:24:55,720 No, they came to us to say that Renault weren't trying to do late, late show, road shows. 1666 01:24:55,720 --> 01:24:58,860 Outside of his radio and TV contract. 1667 01:24:59,460 --> 01:25:03,440 And I can only assume that it was going to lock in that sponsorship for another five years. 1668 01:25:03,440 --> 01:25:05,000 And they're still sponsoring the show. 1669 01:25:05,720 --> 01:25:12,160 Yeah, but at the same time, you made sure, and it was you that made sure, that RT underwrote the deal. 1670 01:25:12,700 --> 01:25:21,980 Yeah, but underwrote it. RT were never going to pay for this. This is always a Renault deal. That Renault were going to pay for extra services for Ryan. That's what it was. Never for RT. 1671 01:25:21,980 --> 01:25:24,820 So it was originally to be a one-year deal. 1672 01:25:25,240 --> 01:25:26,260 No, it was a five-year deal. 1673 01:25:26,260 --> 01:25:31,220 So your hope was that this was going to be Renault over five years. 1674 01:25:31,220 --> 01:25:31,980 Well, absolutely. 1675 01:25:31,980 --> 01:25:33,120 We're going to keep doing this. 1676 01:25:33,120 --> 01:25:39,180 Sure. And what I asked RT to underwrite it was that if there was a change of sponsor, that we could then... 1677 01:25:39,180 --> 01:25:40,220 But what if... 1678 01:25:40,220 --> 01:25:41,400 Because that's again true RT. 1679 01:25:41,400 --> 01:25:51,360 But what if Renault pulled out? Was it always your understanding that if Renault pulled out, it didn't matter, my client was still going to get his sum of money every year? 1680 01:25:51,360 --> 01:25:58,380 No, if Renault pulled out and the new sponsor wasn't right or suitable or wasn't working either part... 1681 01:25:58,380 --> 01:25:59,360 Or if there wasn't a new... 1682 01:25:59,360 --> 01:26:00,460 Then the whole thing would just stop then. 1683 01:26:00,980 --> 01:26:05,280 Okay, so then why was it that RT are continuing to make payments? 1684 01:26:05,980 --> 01:26:10,940 No, Astus paid us, not RTE. Renault paid us the first year, then Astus paid the next year. 1685 01:26:11,020 --> 01:26:13,740 But did you not ask then who are Astus? 1686 01:26:14,540 --> 01:26:24,400 RT instruct us. Honestly, like at this stage, everybody's so wise. We are just working under instruction. It's their relationship. It's a huge contact for them. 1687 01:26:25,660 --> 01:26:33,900 Would it never have struck you... If I was getting, you know, 75,000 euro from a company like Astus, I'd surely ask who are Astus? 1688 01:26:34,600 --> 01:26:36,220 I never asked who are RTE. 1689 01:26:37,220 --> 01:26:39,780 But we know who RTE are. 1690 01:26:39,780 --> 01:26:41,100 I know, I know, I know, but... 1691 01:26:41,100 --> 01:26:42,300 We know who Renault are. 1692 01:26:42,500 --> 01:26:44,640 I don't think anybody here knew who asked us were. 1693 01:26:44,640 --> 01:26:50,580 Okay, I think I'll have to conclude, Senator Byrne, and we can continue the conversation. I'm sure everybody needs a break. 1694 01:26:50,840 --> 01:26:51,120 I'm sure, thank you. 1695 01:26:51,120 --> 01:26:52,340 We're going around in circles a little bit. 1696 01:26:52,560 --> 01:26:59,980 So I'm going to suspend the meeting for 10 minutes, and we will resume again with Senator Micheál Carraghy. 1697 01:27:02,020 --> 01:27:18,480 Wonderful Maverick. Thank you very much. 10 minutes. Need to go to the loo and I'll make another cup of tea. I might even get myself... I might even indulge in a lovely NK Ultra Cadbury's Dairy Milk Mini. 1698 01:27:18,480 --> 01:27:36,980 What are you going to do? I'm not sure. You might even... You have 10 minutes to maybe check out the lovely selection of new Renaults that are... that are doing the rounds. Tell you, Renault really getting a fucking great... They're getting more bang for their buck than they ever, ever imagined. 1699 01:27:36,980 --> 01:27:53,140 I think Renault could really just come out of the woodwork here and really a bit of decent PR for themselves would be to just go, here lads, what's the discrepancy in the payment? You know, what was published and what did he get? All right, okay, here you go. 1700 01:27:54,260 --> 01:28:03,780 What's it to us? It's fucking nothing. We've paid it. Now get back to work, Ollie. You're wasting people's time. Imagine that. Everyone would be like, fucking Renault. Fair play to you. 1701 01:28:05,180 --> 01:28:08,340 Maybe not, though. Okay, see you in 10 minutes. 1702 01:28:11,160 --> 01:28:12,420 You hammered your mother. 1703 01:28:13,560 --> 01:28:14,660 You are a liar. 1704 01:28:15,600 --> 01:28:18,680 I don't know why you're so obsessed with me. 1705 01:28:18,680 --> 01:28:48,660 Thank you. 1706 01:28:48,660 --> 01:29:18,640 Thank you. 1707 01:29:18,640 --> 01:29:48,620 Thank you. 1708 01:29:48,620 --> 01:30:18,600 Thank you. 1709 01:30:18,600 --> 01:30:48,580 Thank you. 1710 01:30:48,580 --> 01:30:50,580 Thank you. 1711 01:30:50,580 --> 01:30:52,580 Thank you. 1712 01:30:52,580 --> 01:30:52,580 Thank you. 1713 01:30:52,580 --> 01:30:54,580 Thank you. 1714 01:30:54,580 --> 01:30:56,580 Thank you. 1715 01:30:56,580 --> 01:30:58,580 Thank you. 1716 01:30:58,580 --> 01:31:00,580 Thank you. 1717 01:31:00,580 --> 01:31:02,580 Thank you. 1718 01:31:02,580 --> 01:31:10,580 Thank you. 1719 01:31:10,580 --> 01:31:12,580 Thank you. 1720 01:31:12,580 --> 01:31:40,580 *music* 1721 01:31:40,580 --> 01:32:00,580 You've driven the best you can drive. Now drive something you've never driven before. The Renault Kangoo. Proudly sponsoring the Joint Committee on Tourism, Culture, Arts, Sport and Media. 1722 01:32:00,580 --> 01:32:04,580 Renault. Drive to believe. 1723 01:32:04,580 --> 01:32:22,580 *music* 1724 01:32:22,580 --> 01:32:34,580 *music* 1725 01:32:34,580 --> 01:32:36,580 *music* 1726 01:32:36,580 --> 01:32:36,580 *music* 1727 01:32:36,580 --> 01:32:38,580 *music* 1728 01:32:38,580 --> 01:32:40,580 *music* 1729 01:32:40,580 --> 01:32:42,580 *music* 1730 01:32:42,580 --> 01:32:42,580 *music* 1731 01:32:42,580 --> 01:32:44,580 *music* 1732 01:32:44,580 --> 01:32:46,580 *music* 1733 01:32:46,580 --> 01:32:48,580 *music* 1734 01:32:48,580 --> 01:32:50,580 *music* 1735 01:32:50,580 --> 01:33:11,040 The dream. The odometer. The speedometer. Pure motherfucking Renault. Drive to believe, and believe to drive. 1736 01:33:11,960 --> 01:33:20,920 Renault. Proud sponsors of the Joint Committee on Tourism, Culture, Arts, Sport and Media. 1737 01:33:20,920 --> 01:33:50,900 The Joint Committee on Tourism, Culture, Arts, Sport and Media. 1738 01:33:50,900 --> 01:34:05,640 Have you ever, ever driven a sexual car as good as this? The new Renault Arcana Iconic. It's a pleasure doing business with us. 1739 01:34:07,040 --> 01:34:08,920 Can we get the music on again, please? Sorry. 1740 01:34:14,100 --> 01:34:16,080 Can you change the music there, please? 1741 01:34:20,880 --> 01:34:44,700 Feel the dream of French perfection. 1742 01:34:44,700 --> 01:34:47,940 A car like none other. 1743 01:34:49,540 --> 01:34:51,820 The Renault of your life. 1744 01:34:54,280 --> 01:34:59,440 Optional final payment, $13,350. Offers higher purchase subject to lending criteria. 1745 01:35:00,380 --> 01:35:01,520 Hybrid by nature. 1746 01:35:02,540 --> 01:35:03,620 Renault Arcana. 1747 01:35:04,440 --> 01:35:06,340 Renault. Proud sponsors. 1748 01:35:07,700 --> 01:35:12,120 Proud sponsors of the Joint Committee on Tourism, Culture, Arts, Sport and Media. 1749 01:35:16,120 --> 01:35:31,200 Have you ever driven through a forest? 1750 01:35:31,200 --> 01:35:41,160 to dawn fast you haven't driven anywhere until you've driven a Renault don't mind 1751 01:35:41,160 --> 01:35:49,460 that skip on there skip skip on to the next bit there impressive boot space you 1752 01:35:49,460 --> 01:35:55,360 can get anything inside this boot it's got an extra side hatch as well for when 1753 01:35:55,360 --> 01:36:01,600 times get tough lift up the side hatch compatibility unit and you've got an 1754 01:36:01,600 --> 01:36:09,160 extra spare bit of fucking space to hide your stuff ride the load and load the 1755 01:36:09,160 --> 01:36:17,520 ride put the seats down and change the dynamic of the way you drive your vehicle 1756 01:36:17,520 --> 01:36:46,760 space is yours make use of it when you can the new Renault Arkham the Renault Triber life on demand for when you need it when times get tough Renault will be there for you Renault proudly sponsoring the joint committee on tourism culture arts sport and media Ryan did nothing wrong 1757 01:36:46,760 --> 01:37:16,000 remember that and know as well he's sound the time has come to drive again are you ready but you didn't know it was gonna come so fast me neither feel the power 1758 01:37:16,000 --> 01:37:41,000 the power underneath your seat of pure electric magic a hybrid to end all hybrids a beautiful blend of machinery and sustainability cruise through open fields and road like a king of the night and day Renault pure French magic 1759 01:37:41,000 --> 01:38:02,000 proudly sponsoring the joint committee on tourism culture arts sports media it's coming back in five minutes hold on tight the Renault renaissance 1760 01:38:02,000 --> 01:38:31,980 plenty of boot space for your Renault merchandise and competitive price to 235 euro per month starting price 28,000 990 it's a lot of money but break it down get a loan out or something you want to drive the latest year car to make other people see that you're doing well even if you even if it's on a low just get that loan and get it going you'll feel good in 1761 01:38:31,980 --> 01:38:52,860 yourself as well Renault. Once upon a time in a land far far away a hybrid like 1762 01:38:52,860 --> 01:39:05,220 none other came out to play the Renault Arcana premium Renault magic it's a it's an iconic triptonic 1763 01:39:05,220 --> 01:39:14,240 supersonic electronic 29,000 euro beast machine committee room 4 proudly sponsors the Renault 1764 01:39:14,240 --> 01:39:30,000 dream it's a premium price but the price is like none other Arcana feel the dream drive the machine 1765 01:39:30,000 --> 01:39:40,040 Renault in association with Carzone proudly sponsors the joint committee on tourism culture arts sport and 1766 01:39:40,040 --> 01:39:46,040 media. 1767 01:39:46,040 --> 01:39:52,040 So 1768 01:39:52,040 --> 01:39:58,040 so 1769 01:39:58,040 --> 01:40:04,040 so 1770 01:40:04,040 --> 01:40:10,040 so 1771 01:40:10,040 --> 01:40:10,040 so 1772 01:40:10,040 --> 01:40:16,040 so 1773 01:40:16,040 --> 01:40:16,040 so 1774 01:40:16,040 --> 01:40:22,040 so 1775 01:40:22,040 --> 01:40:28,040 so 1776 01:40:28,040 --> 01:40:28,040 so 1777 01:40:28,040 --> 01:40:28,040 so 1778 01:40:28,040 --> 01:40:30,040 so 1779 01:40:30,040 --> 01:40:30,040 so 1780 01:40:30,040 --> 01:40:32,040 so 1781 01:40:32,040 --> 01:40:34,040 so 1782 01:40:34,040 --> 01:40:36,040 so 1783 01:40:36,040 --> 01:40:36,040 so 1784 01:40:36,040 --> 01:40:38,040 so 1785 01:40:38,040 --> 01:40:39,220 at the same time as well. 1786 01:40:39,580 --> 01:40:41,560 Of only 2.11% APR, 1787 01:40:42,000 --> 01:40:43,920 the hybrid and electric Renault range 1788 01:40:43,920 --> 01:40:45,140 is waiting for you now. 1789 01:40:45,660 --> 01:40:46,680 Passion for life. 1790 01:40:47,500 --> 01:40:49,180 Proud sponsors of the Joint Committee 1791 01:40:49,180 --> 01:40:51,160 on Tourism, Culture, Arts, and Sporting Media. 1792 01:40:52,300 --> 01:40:53,740 We work hard 1793 01:40:53,740 --> 01:40:57,760 to develop our hybrid and electric technology, 1794 01:40:57,760 --> 01:40:58,980 not just for one, 1795 01:40:59,980 --> 01:41:01,680 but for all. 1796 01:41:02,840 --> 01:41:04,320 One Renault for all. 1797 01:41:06,160 --> 01:41:07,840 One all for Renault. 1798 01:41:08,800 --> 01:41:10,540 E-Tech hybrid technology 1799 01:41:10,540 --> 01:41:11,860 born to perform. 1800 01:41:12,660 --> 01:41:14,200 The number one electric vehicle 1801 01:41:14,200 --> 01:41:15,280 in Ireland 2020. 1802 01:41:16,040 --> 01:41:18,380 Renault. Cream your dream tonight. 1803 01:41:22,120 --> 01:41:24,580 Who the fuck do you think you are 1804 01:41:24,580 --> 01:41:26,240 watching these adverts? 1805 01:41:26,680 --> 01:41:28,320 You're not even worthy 1806 01:41:28,320 --> 01:41:31,280 of the new Renault Arcana range. 1807 01:41:32,740 --> 01:41:34,100 Have you got the money? 1808 01:41:34,740 --> 01:41:35,520 If you don't, 1809 01:41:35,920 --> 01:41:36,840 you're gonna have to beg, 1810 01:41:37,120 --> 01:41:37,920 borrow, fight, 1811 01:41:38,120 --> 01:41:39,500 fuck your way to survive 1812 01:41:39,500 --> 01:41:41,180 in order to get the capital 1813 01:41:41,180 --> 01:41:44,340 to really drive into the night. 1814 01:41:44,860 --> 01:41:45,840 And who could blame you? 1815 01:41:47,140 --> 01:41:48,000 It's a continental, 1816 01:41:48,780 --> 01:41:49,340 medium, 1817 01:41:49,700 --> 01:41:51,060 Irish medium crossover 1818 01:41:51,060 --> 01:41:52,980 SUV of the year 2022. 1819 01:41:55,080 --> 01:41:56,480 You either have the money for it, 1820 01:41:57,160 --> 01:41:58,040 or you don't. 1821 01:41:58,040 --> 01:41:59,300 you're going to have to be a good one. 1822 01:41:59,300 --> 01:41:59,720 You're going to have to be a good one. 1823 01:41:59,720 --> 01:42:00,560 You're going to have to be a good one. 1824 01:42:00,560 --> 01:42:01,020 You're going to have to be a good one. 1825 01:42:01,020 --> 01:42:01,600 You're going to have to be a good one. 1826 01:42:01,600 --> 01:42:02,460 You're going to have to be a good one. 1827 01:42:02,460 --> 01:42:02,880 You're going to have to be a good one. 1828 01:42:02,880 --> 01:42:03,320 You're going to have to be a good one. 1829 01:42:03,320 --> 01:42:03,820 You're going to have to be a good one. 1830 01:42:03,820 --> 01:42:04,820 You're going to have to be a good one. 1831 01:42:04,820 --> 01:42:05,380 You're going to have to be a good one. 1832 01:42:05,380 --> 01:42:05,820 You're going to have to be a good one. 1833 01:42:05,820 --> 01:42:06,500 You're going to have to be a good one. 1834 01:42:06,500 --> 01:42:06,760 You're going to have to be a good one. 1835 01:42:06,820 --> 01:42:07,660 You're going to have to be a good one. 1836 01:42:07,660 --> 01:42:37,640 You're going to have to be a good one. 1837 01:42:37,640 --> 01:42:47,260 You're going to have to be a good one. 1838 01:42:47,260 --> 01:42:53,420 You're going to have to be a good one. 1839 01:42:53,420 --> 01:42:55,640 You're going to have to be a good one. 1840 01:42:55,640 --> 01:42:58,300 It's time to fucking play with the big boys. 1841 01:42:58,300 --> 01:43:00,380 Challenge us if you can. 1842 01:43:00,980 --> 01:43:03,720 With the new Renault V6 Challenge. 1843 01:43:04,540 --> 01:43:07,960 We invite anyone to try and speed against us. 1844 01:43:08,860 --> 01:43:11,680 We're going to be in the Renault taxi, Megan. 1845 01:43:12,820 --> 01:43:14,860 Doing 90 around Paris. 1846 01:43:15,740 --> 01:43:17,680 Nothing gay about Paris tonight. 1847 01:43:18,800 --> 01:43:21,160 We're behind the wheel of a rocket ship to Mars. 1848 01:43:22,120 --> 01:43:24,080 You've either got it or you don't. 1849 01:43:24,160 --> 01:43:25,660 We're to Senator Micheál Carrey. 1850 01:43:25,820 --> 01:43:27,460 The floor is yours and you have ten minutes. 1851 01:43:28,000 --> 01:43:30,440 Thanks very much, Chair, to welcome both of us. 1852 01:43:30,440 --> 01:43:32,760 This is your this morning. 1853 01:43:32,920 --> 01:43:40,960 I think you'd be remiss of me not, while we're discussing what we're discussing today, not acknowledge the good work that you've done down through the years. 1854 01:43:41,320 --> 01:43:47,600 You know, the joy in particular to those as a parent of young kids that the joy show does provide on an annual basis in our house. 1855 01:43:47,600 --> 01:43:49,780 So I just want to acknowledge that. 1856 01:43:49,860 --> 01:43:50,500 I appreciate that. 1857 01:43:50,600 --> 01:43:50,960 Thank you. 1858 01:43:51,240 --> 01:43:59,440 First of all, Mr. Kelly, I'm just going to come to yourself just in relation to the whole, I suppose, deal as such as it is. 1859 01:44:00,100 --> 01:44:04,980 If I buy a car and I go to a car dealer, I pay for a car and I get an invoice for a car. 1860 01:44:05,660 --> 01:44:08,620 If I ask for an invoice for a lorry, I won't get it. 1861 01:44:12,060 --> 01:44:19,220 Why, when you were inviced, did you use the term that you did on the invoice? 1862 01:44:19,300 --> 01:44:22,040 I was put forward by RT even though you knew it was factually incorrect. 1863 01:44:22,400 --> 01:44:25,060 Because that's what they asked us to do. 1864 01:44:25,240 --> 01:44:26,660 Even though you knew it was factually incorrect. 1865 01:44:26,660 --> 01:44:31,200 I am sorry if I could just clarify for a second. 1866 01:44:36,320 --> 01:44:44,280 So on page 25 in the pack there, instructions for invoicing from RTE. 1867 01:44:44,740 --> 01:44:51,100 That's what they asked us to do and I had no reason not to trust them. 1868 01:44:51,600 --> 01:44:54,140 But as I say, as you know, it's factually incorrect. 1869 01:44:54,140 --> 01:44:57,660 You yourself are a company director, many, many years of experience. 1870 01:44:58,800 --> 01:45:00,960 It's surprising to me that you didn't question it. 1871 01:45:01,540 --> 01:45:12,980 The fact that it was to a company based in the UK, not as in the first year, which was to Renault, which was for 75,000 plus VAT, 17,250. 1872 01:45:13,680 --> 01:45:22,420 The two invoices then for both 21 and 22 were to the UK at a 0% VAT. 1873 01:45:23,220 --> 01:45:30,400 Would that not arise questions in your own mind about the fact that this was an invoice for services? 1874 01:45:30,400 --> 01:45:31,340 Drive the team! 1875 01:45:31,340 --> 01:45:37,240 And the fact that it wasn't even VAT rated or was zero VAT rated to a company through the UK. 1876 01:45:37,780 --> 01:45:38,020 Sure. 1877 01:45:40,460 --> 01:45:41,780 My antenna wasn't open. 1878 01:45:41,920 --> 01:45:42,940 I just trusted RTE. 1879 01:45:45,380 --> 01:45:46,840 Where the instructions came from. 1880 01:45:48,180 --> 01:45:55,540 I didn't find that hard to believe, someone with the experience that you have as a company director, that that wouldn't. 1881 01:45:56,040 --> 01:46:03,160 And anyone that would be auditing or within your own internal company that wouldn't have a flag wouldn't have been raised in relation to that. 1882 01:46:03,380 --> 01:46:09,580 What percentage did you get, say, of the Renault deal, which was in year one, which totaled, as I say, 92,250. 1883 01:46:10,220 --> 01:46:14,320 Could you get a cut out of that deal or was that solely for Mr. Traverdee? 1884 01:46:17,520 --> 01:46:17,920 Confer! 1885 01:46:20,900 --> 01:46:26,120 To be honest, we've come to talk about the issues that are here. 1886 01:46:26,300 --> 01:46:27,320 I don't feel it's relevant. 1887 01:46:28,740 --> 01:46:29,600 What percentage? 1888 01:46:32,600 --> 01:46:37,140 I just really want to know, was there a percentage for yourself in that arrangement that was put together with RTE? 1889 01:46:37,460 --> 01:46:38,740 You were saying it was with RTE. 1890 01:46:38,920 --> 01:46:40,920 I just want to know, was there a percentage for NK? 1891 01:46:43,300 --> 01:46:48,900 Did you benefit financially from this arrangement over the three-year term in any way? 1892 01:46:49,060 --> 01:46:51,620 Or was it solely the benefit of Tuttle? 1893 01:46:54,140 --> 01:47:01,120 As I said, we came to talk about the issues at hand, but that's not one of the issues. 1894 01:47:01,220 --> 01:47:02,680 But this is core to the issue at hand. 1895 01:47:02,840 --> 01:47:03,360 That's the question. 1896 01:47:03,440 --> 01:47:04,400 That's why I'm asking the question. 1897 01:47:04,400 --> 01:47:14,780 These were the questions put by the committee to us, and that's what we've been working on. 1898 01:47:16,440 --> 01:47:19,320 Do I not have a right, maybe, Chair, to ask the question? 1899 01:47:19,400 --> 01:47:22,200 Because I think it is relevant to what we're discussing. 1900 01:47:26,740 --> 01:47:28,800 It's not relevant. 1901 01:47:32,160 --> 01:47:33,540 I think it is. 1902 01:47:34,300 --> 01:47:35,620 I think it's completely relevant. 1903 01:47:35,780 --> 01:47:37,540 I'm sorry, should I give the Chair? 1904 01:47:37,780 --> 01:47:40,600 Take care of his £75,000 payments. 1905 01:47:40,900 --> 01:47:45,080 If they were via taxpayer's money, I think he has an obligation to answer that question. 1906 01:47:45,080 --> 01:47:46,280 Okay, can I take some advice here? 1907 01:47:50,280 --> 01:48:08,740 Mr Kerry, I've been told that it's not within remit. 1908 01:48:08,740 --> 01:48:15,620 However, if Mr Kerry does want to answer, I think, taking your comments, you don't want to answer that question at this moment in time. 1909 01:48:16,000 --> 01:48:16,260 Okay. 1910 01:48:17,660 --> 01:48:18,340 Next question. 1911 01:48:18,380 --> 01:48:20,740 I think that's disappointing. 1912 01:48:21,500 --> 01:48:24,920 I think, as we said at the beginning, we were trying to get all the facts to all the questions. 1913 01:48:25,620 --> 01:48:31,140 It's disappointing that you wouldn't answer that question, because I think it's core to the whole situation. 1914 01:48:31,300 --> 01:48:43,340 But staying on that, why did you invoice for the second two years from a different company, CMS, rather than NK, which you invoiced in the first year? 1915 01:48:44,000 --> 01:48:54,440 And also, you might ask me, in the documents that we have here, as I look at, there are certain email addresses redacted within it, within the documentation over and back. 1916 01:48:55,660 --> 01:49:02,120 Some names, some email addresses are there, particularly Gerlina O'Leary in correspondence over and back. 1917 01:49:02,660 --> 01:49:06,540 But others at RTE are redacted. 1918 01:49:07,160 --> 01:49:10,300 Who are, whose email addresses are redacted? 1919 01:49:10,380 --> 01:49:13,740 And who is Jay on page 11? 1920 01:49:13,860 --> 01:49:14,740 I'm assuming that's Jim Kelly. 1921 01:49:14,820 --> 01:49:19,340 If I could read out to you, we got a letter from Arthur Cox, and it says, 1922 01:49:19,820 --> 01:49:22,840 Your clients, Ryan Troubledy and NK Management, our client, RTE. 1923 01:49:23,180 --> 01:49:31,400 Dear colleagues, we understand that Mr Troubledy and Mr Kelly have agreed to attend the Dahl Committee of Public Accounts and the Rockets Joint Committee on Tourism, Culture, Arts, Sport, Media on the 11th of July. 1924 01:49:32,260 --> 01:49:36,640 To that extent, your clients have been requested to provide documentation to committees. 1925 01:49:37,000 --> 01:49:43,860 Our clients request that they ensure that they do so in accordance with their obligations pursuant to the Data General Protection Regulation, GDPR. 1926 01:49:44,260 --> 01:49:52,160 Our clients also request that it is provided with copies of all documents that your clients intend to provide to the committees in advance of your clients' attendance at the Dahl Committee. 1927 01:49:52,720 --> 01:49:58,780 Our clients are at 11.30, 3.30pm, 11 July 23. 1928 01:49:59,060 --> 01:50:08,880 So we've tried to provide you with absolutely everything, and this is Arthur Cox on behalf of RT asking us to redact some information. 1929 01:50:09,460 --> 01:50:15,900 So Arthur Cox has said to redact certain email addresses, but not other email addresses of the correspondence over and back. 1930 01:50:18,400 --> 01:50:20,440 That's necessary to comply with GDPR. 1931 01:50:21,380 --> 01:50:23,000 Why provide some and not others? 1932 01:50:23,120 --> 01:50:25,320 If GDPR, then it'll be autoredacted. 1933 01:50:25,920 --> 01:50:27,100 I honestly don't know. 1934 01:50:30,920 --> 01:50:31,800 Sorry, yeah. 1935 01:50:32,300 --> 01:50:44,040 Sorry, it was proportionality where you can redact junior people that aren't, they have no problem with the executives, but any junior staff they didn't want, from a GDPR perspective, their names. 1936 01:50:45,320 --> 01:50:48,700 Well then that would tell us that there's other staff, other people acknowledge that these agreements. 1937 01:50:48,700 --> 01:50:50,860 Where are we even at here? I don't even know where we're at. 1938 01:50:50,860 --> 01:50:52,600 And where's the fucking attack dogs? 1939 01:50:52,600 --> 01:50:54,700 We need to get some more attack dogs in there. 1940 01:50:55,620 --> 01:50:59,200 We've had ten minutes fresh break, now it seems like there's a softballer. 1941 01:50:59,440 --> 01:51:01,400 We don't need any more softballers. 1942 01:51:01,540 --> 01:51:02,420 We want Boyd Barrett. 1943 01:51:02,960 --> 01:51:04,320 We want Matty McGrath. 1944 01:51:04,640 --> 01:51:06,380 We want a few other fucking... 1945 01:51:06,380 --> 01:51:11,900 People who are off the chain, ready to chomp, you know? 1946 01:51:11,900 --> 01:51:16,360 Thanks very much to Jacob Rees-Tubbs and Richard Boyd Barrett. 1947 01:51:16,860 --> 01:51:18,300 Artful Maverick, thank you very much. 1948 01:51:19,140 --> 01:51:27,720 I'll tell you, the Renault, the Renault Megane or the Renault slogan of drive the change really took me by surprise. 1949 01:51:27,840 --> 01:51:29,540 I didn't think they'd go for something like that. 1950 01:51:30,600 --> 01:51:34,800 It really fit in with everything we were going for, everything we dreamed about. 1951 01:51:34,880 --> 01:51:38,980 I think that's really pertinent to sort of April-ish time, 22. 1952 01:51:39,480 --> 01:51:43,820 I'm saying January to March, leading up to these invoices being raised. 1953 01:51:44,260 --> 01:51:50,720 What was the discussion from NK to RTE looking for these invoices to be fulfilled, 1954 01:51:50,840 --> 01:51:52,540 or looking for the contract to be fulfilled? 1955 01:51:52,840 --> 01:51:56,220 I just would like to know who initiated that conversation, 1956 01:51:56,420 --> 01:51:58,460 and just to see that conversation over and back, 1957 01:51:58,880 --> 01:52:03,260 which formed disagreement being put together with regard to invoice and actus. 1958 01:52:03,900 --> 01:52:06,720 We don't have that information in the weeks leading into it. 1959 01:52:06,720 --> 01:52:07,280 Yeah. 1960 01:52:09,580 --> 01:52:10,100 Yeah. 1961 01:52:10,540 --> 01:52:13,800 Again, that's in the document, page 25. 1962 01:52:14,660 --> 01:52:17,620 No, them documents are dated the 29th of April, 1963 01:52:18,280 --> 01:52:20,720 which are from, hi, Jarlene, from Jay. 1964 01:52:20,800 --> 01:52:24,360 I presume that's Jim Jennings to say use actus, 1965 01:52:24,480 --> 01:52:29,140 but in previous testimony, we were told the previous weeks 1966 01:52:29,140 --> 01:52:33,060 that there was a bit of pressure coming for these amounts to be paid. 1967 01:52:33,540 --> 01:52:36,760 I just would like to see any correspondence over and back 1968 01:52:36,760 --> 01:52:42,120 to see how that conversation happened until we came to this point. 1969 01:52:42,340 --> 01:52:43,900 We don't think there is any. 1970 01:52:45,900 --> 01:52:50,280 So just out of the blue, RTE or Jim Jennings decided 1971 01:52:50,280 --> 01:52:54,620 to email Geraldine O'Leary telling her we need to invoice actus. 1972 01:52:54,620 --> 01:52:55,880 So some conversation. 1973 01:52:56,040 --> 01:52:59,040 It was stated, I can't recall who said it, 1974 01:52:59,120 --> 01:53:00,620 at one of the previous meetings, 1975 01:53:00,920 --> 01:53:03,960 but there was pressure on for these two amounts to be paid. 1976 01:53:03,960 --> 01:53:05,800 I don't like eating this much chocolate, 1977 01:53:05,960 --> 01:53:07,360 but I'm in the mood. 1978 01:53:07,600 --> 01:53:08,700 I'd like to see correspondents... 1979 01:53:08,700 --> 01:53:11,660 I don't really like to be eating too much chocolate of a day, 1980 01:53:11,800 --> 01:53:13,800 especially when it gets a bit late like this, you know. 1981 01:53:14,680 --> 01:53:18,540 Same with the coffee, but I do need a little bit of a boost here, 1982 01:53:18,600 --> 01:53:21,020 because they've got the softballers in, 1983 01:53:21,220 --> 01:53:25,040 and the softballers aren't yielding any line grass sort of fucking questions. 1984 01:53:25,560 --> 01:53:28,100 The guys that were in before they took the break, 1985 01:53:28,240 --> 01:53:30,120 they took a break because they were on the ropes. 1986 01:53:30,640 --> 01:53:34,420 So we need to get some fucking heavy-duty maulers in there. 1987 01:53:34,520 --> 01:53:35,940 There's nobody giving them a mauling. 1988 01:53:37,940 --> 01:53:44,440 So you did not elicit a contact RTE at any stage looking for these two amounts to be paid. 1989 01:53:44,860 --> 01:53:47,580 They came to you looking to put this deal in place. 1990 01:53:47,580 --> 01:53:50,500 Yeah, and agreement there. 1991 01:53:50,680 --> 01:53:51,540 A few people... 1992 01:53:51,540 --> 01:53:55,480 We need someone, as Conrad says, 1993 01:53:55,540 --> 01:53:57,800 we need someone to go for the jugular here. 1994 01:53:58,500 --> 01:54:01,260 The Fianna Fáil, Fianna Gael guys are not cutting it. 1995 01:54:01,260 --> 01:54:03,760 from NK to fulfil the contract. 1996 01:54:05,440 --> 01:54:07,480 We will get all that information. 1997 01:54:07,680 --> 01:54:08,780 We will elicit it. 1998 01:54:09,360 --> 01:54:11,320 And Senator Kerry, just to conclude... 1999 01:54:11,320 --> 01:54:13,520 Apologies now that I was held up for a couple of minutes... 2000 01:54:13,520 --> 01:54:14,180 That's OK, yeah, yeah. 2001 01:54:14,180 --> 01:54:15,160 I'm just reminding you. 2002 01:54:15,940 --> 01:54:19,180 I'm delighted that you clarified the fact that the money will be refunded 2003 01:54:19,180 --> 01:54:21,580 if the six shows don't take place. 2004 01:54:21,580 --> 01:54:21,940 Absolutely. 2005 01:54:22,060 --> 01:54:22,460 Which... 2006 01:54:22,460 --> 01:54:23,200 I stand by that. 2007 01:54:23,460 --> 01:54:26,420 That would have helped if that had come out earlier, to be quite honest. 2008 01:54:26,540 --> 01:54:26,640 Yeah. 2009 01:54:26,640 --> 01:54:28,860 Today was the first of it because there's something... 2010 01:54:28,860 --> 01:54:31,480 I know I felt very strongly that that money needs to be paid back. 2011 01:54:31,580 --> 01:54:32,840 I know taxes have been paid on it. 2012 01:54:32,840 --> 01:54:38,060 We've had, you know, this three weeks to put together, 2013 01:54:38,260 --> 01:54:40,740 as comprehensive and as transparent as possible, 2014 01:54:41,620 --> 01:54:45,140 a series of documents so that you as senators 2015 01:54:45,140 --> 01:54:49,380 and deputies with a lot more, I suspect, serious things to be dealing with, 2016 01:54:49,880 --> 01:54:53,260 can hopefully get through this fog and come out the other side. 2017 01:54:55,040 --> 01:54:55,820 This is serious. 2018 01:54:55,820 --> 01:54:56,020 I'm hoping. 2019 01:54:56,360 --> 01:54:56,820 No, no, no. 2020 01:54:57,260 --> 01:54:58,560 I'm not trying to diminish this. 2021 01:54:58,640 --> 01:55:01,120 I'm just saying in a country with a lot going on... 2022 01:55:01,120 --> 01:55:01,960 It's licensure money. 2023 01:55:02,080 --> 01:55:02,780 It's taxpayers' money. 2024 01:55:02,960 --> 01:55:03,900 I appreciate that too. 2025 01:55:03,900 --> 01:55:04,360 It is serious. 2026 01:55:04,480 --> 01:55:05,500 There are many serious issues. 2027 01:55:05,760 --> 01:55:06,280 Apologies now. 2028 01:55:06,380 --> 01:55:07,740 I'm going to be caught on time. 2029 01:55:07,880 --> 01:55:09,140 But just... 2030 01:55:09,140 --> 01:55:12,720 Would you say, Mr. Kelly, you know, 2031 01:55:12,760 --> 01:55:15,700 how much advertising or product do you bring in to RTE? 2032 01:55:15,820 --> 01:55:17,440 Because you carry a lot of clout, 2033 01:55:18,000 --> 01:55:20,580 and I'd say you'll be able to get a better deal for your clients 2034 01:55:20,580 --> 01:55:24,080 due to what you bring to the table from other areas. 2035 01:55:24,760 --> 01:55:27,880 What would you bring in to RTE yourself as regards 2036 01:55:27,880 --> 01:55:30,500 from other organisations or companies? 2037 01:55:32,000 --> 01:55:35,480 Very little apart from I negotiate contracts, 2038 01:55:35,580 --> 01:55:40,040 and then if we have some younger people or whatever they be 2039 01:55:40,040 --> 01:55:40,800 that we're working with, 2040 01:55:40,860 --> 01:55:43,940 if we try to get sponsored for some of their shows... 2041 01:55:43,940 --> 01:55:44,220 You have been paying in line. 2042 01:55:44,220 --> 01:55:45,840 ...with an independent production company, 2043 01:55:46,000 --> 01:55:47,960 and then we can try and put that on Virgin, 2044 01:55:48,120 --> 01:55:50,140 or we can try and put that on RTE, 2045 01:55:50,400 --> 01:55:52,880 or streaming services. 2046 01:55:52,880 --> 01:55:54,880 So it's... 2047 01:55:54,880 --> 01:55:57,680 The whole media model's changing, you know. 2048 01:56:00,100 --> 01:56:03,660 It's hard to look at anybody now to say 2049 01:56:03,660 --> 01:56:04,700 who they might be listening to, 2050 01:56:04,760 --> 01:56:05,460 what they're watching. 2051 01:56:05,740 --> 01:56:07,700 You know, I certainly know in my own house, 2052 01:56:07,760 --> 01:56:09,980 all my own kids are just watching everything 2053 01:56:09,980 --> 01:56:10,800 on all sorts of devices. 2054 01:56:10,940 --> 01:56:12,180 So it's a changing market. 2055 01:56:12,420 --> 01:56:13,880 And you have no other agreements or any other... 2056 01:56:13,880 --> 01:56:15,180 Carrie, we do have to move on. 2057 01:56:15,220 --> 01:56:15,860 Just a couple of minutes. 2058 01:56:16,080 --> 01:56:16,760 I apologise now. 2059 01:56:16,760 --> 01:56:17,160 Please, please do. 2060 01:56:17,340 --> 01:56:18,100 Way over time. 2061 01:56:18,500 --> 01:56:20,640 Man, this question's going to be a softball. 2062 01:56:20,720 --> 01:56:21,340 It's going to be rubbish. 2063 01:56:21,340 --> 01:56:23,480 Being notified Mr Kelly was here... 2064 01:56:23,480 --> 01:56:25,060 Kelly's loving this. 2065 01:56:25,200 --> 01:56:27,600 ...other information with regard to the time scales 2066 01:56:27,600 --> 01:56:31,620 of you notifying RTE and then the announcement. 2067 01:56:32,240 --> 01:56:34,260 And I think the date you gave me was... 2068 01:56:34,260 --> 01:56:36,780 RTE was notified on the 13th by herself, if I correct, 2069 01:56:36,840 --> 01:56:38,260 and then was announced on the 16th. 2070 01:56:38,800 --> 01:56:40,260 13th was a Monday, 14th. 2071 01:56:40,260 --> 01:56:41,560 The 16th was the Thursday. 2072 01:56:42,060 --> 01:56:43,320 He just stated that he... 2073 01:56:43,320 --> 01:56:44,560 And he's going to come back to the committee, 2074 01:56:44,760 --> 01:56:45,940 our committee, with emails, 2075 01:56:46,100 --> 01:56:48,240 because he stated that there was emails 2076 01:56:48,240 --> 01:56:49,820 previously that month, 2077 01:56:50,360 --> 01:56:52,380 which was putting together a list of names, 2078 01:56:52,780 --> 01:56:54,780 as potential replacement names, 2079 01:56:55,140 --> 01:56:58,600 for the role as a late judge. 2080 01:56:58,600 --> 01:57:00,680 Sorry, Senator, who is this? 2081 01:57:01,240 --> 01:57:01,900 Adrian Kelly. 2082 01:57:02,500 --> 01:57:03,220 Adrian Lynch. 2083 01:57:03,500 --> 01:57:04,500 Sorry, Adrian Lynch. 2084 01:57:04,740 --> 01:57:06,500 That he was putting together lists of... 2085 01:57:06,500 --> 01:57:07,500 No, there was a list... 2086 01:57:07,500 --> 01:57:08,080 There was a list of... 2087 01:57:08,080 --> 01:57:09,160 An email with a list... 2088 01:57:09,160 --> 01:57:09,160 Adrian Kelly. 2089 01:57:09,160 --> 01:57:10,380 He was going to provide us with them emails. 2090 01:57:10,500 --> 01:57:11,080 Sponsored by email. 2091 01:57:11,080 --> 01:57:12,480 I will have to move on, Senator Carey. 2092 01:57:12,480 --> 01:57:14,720 But I will address your point. 2093 01:57:15,300 --> 01:57:16,780 You will hear 10,000 stories 2094 01:57:16,780 --> 01:57:21,440 about how the Late Late Show decision came to pass. 2095 01:57:22,160 --> 01:57:23,700 There's only one, I believe, 2096 01:57:24,300 --> 01:57:24,880 and that's mine. 2097 01:57:25,600 --> 01:57:26,580 I presented that show. 2098 01:57:27,040 --> 01:57:28,200 I loved working with those people. 2099 01:57:28,820 --> 01:57:29,840 I loved the audience. 2100 01:57:30,260 --> 01:57:31,120 I loved the job. 2101 01:57:31,400 --> 01:57:32,640 I did it for 14 years. 2102 01:57:33,320 --> 01:57:34,560 I ran out of gas. 2103 01:57:35,280 --> 01:57:36,300 I chose to leave. 2104 01:57:36,920 --> 01:57:38,620 There is no conspiracy. 2105 01:57:39,000 --> 01:57:41,980 Now, people will choose to create one 2106 01:57:41,980 --> 01:57:43,360 to muddy the waters, 2107 01:57:43,500 --> 01:57:45,260 but that is the greatest definitive 2108 01:57:45,260 --> 01:57:46,060 I can offer you today. 2109 01:57:46,340 --> 01:57:46,820 I have one minute. 2110 01:57:46,980 --> 01:57:47,460 I apologise. 2111 01:57:47,700 --> 01:57:49,560 I got held up with the train of thought. 2112 01:57:49,560 --> 01:57:51,320 I know, I know, but I have given you loads of latitude. 2113 01:57:51,580 --> 01:57:52,500 In 30 seconds. 2114 01:57:52,640 --> 01:57:54,260 Yeah, no, just in relation to Toy Show, 2115 01:57:54,320 --> 01:57:56,640 the musical, page 11 states about LS Live, 2116 01:57:57,680 --> 01:57:58,800 and you've discussed that, 2117 01:57:58,860 --> 01:58:00,040 the possibility of a live show. 2118 01:58:00,220 --> 01:58:01,300 To be honest, my opinion, 2119 01:58:01,620 --> 01:58:02,880 and we met with people here 2120 01:58:02,880 --> 01:58:03,840 with regard to the musical, 2121 01:58:04,000 --> 01:58:05,140 which was a fantastic idea. 2122 01:58:05,140 --> 01:58:06,460 It drives the change. 2123 01:58:06,920 --> 01:58:07,640 But the fact, I think, 2124 01:58:07,720 --> 01:58:09,920 that you weren't involved, 2125 01:58:10,060 --> 01:58:11,660 I think it was a loser, 2126 01:58:11,820 --> 01:58:13,280 say, from the beginning. 2127 01:58:13,380 --> 01:58:14,520 Oh, no, that wasn't my... 2128 01:58:14,520 --> 01:58:15,700 It was just because of time. 2129 01:58:15,920 --> 01:58:16,540 But I'm just saying, 2130 01:58:17,220 --> 01:58:18,940 one, why did you not want to get involved? 2131 01:58:19,260 --> 01:58:20,720 And two, the fact is that 2132 01:58:20,720 --> 01:58:21,940 the two producers of that show, 2133 01:58:22,020 --> 01:58:23,120 which lost 2.2 million, 2134 01:58:23,200 --> 01:58:24,460 have actually been promoted since. 2135 01:58:24,660 --> 01:58:25,260 And one is actually, 2136 01:58:25,420 --> 01:58:26,320 from my understanding, 2137 01:58:26,540 --> 01:58:28,100 are they a producer on The Late Late? 2138 01:58:28,440 --> 01:58:31,040 But that's all RTs to answer. 2139 01:58:31,400 --> 01:58:33,460 I tell you, the two producers in question 2140 01:58:33,460 --> 01:58:34,780 worked on The Late Late show with me. 2141 01:58:34,860 --> 01:58:36,560 they were superb people to work with. 2142 01:58:36,980 --> 01:58:38,680 But the musical is a question for RT. 2143 01:58:39,320 --> 01:58:40,960 And just in relation to the Toy Show Fund, 2144 01:58:41,060 --> 01:58:42,860 it's just questions that have been asked. 2145 01:58:43,440 --> 01:58:44,560 Is that all 100%? 2146 01:58:44,740 --> 01:58:46,220 The money's raised to the Toy Show Fund, 2147 01:58:46,220 --> 01:58:48,440 100% goes out to charities. 2148 01:58:48,520 --> 01:58:49,260 None of it goes to RT. 2149 01:58:49,320 --> 01:58:51,380 It's one of the greatest legacies I'll have. 2150 01:58:51,440 --> 01:58:54,560 Even if I am given the royal order of the boot from RT on Friday, 2151 01:58:54,820 --> 01:58:57,680 I'll be able to walk out of those gates with my head held high, 2152 01:58:58,000 --> 01:59:00,800 knowing that Irish people, year in, year out, 2153 01:59:00,800 --> 01:59:01,800 in the last three years, 2154 01:59:01,920 --> 01:59:03,520 offered year one, 6 million, 2155 01:59:03,660 --> 01:59:04,740 year two, 6 million, 2156 01:59:04,880 --> 01:59:06,320 year three, 4 million, 2157 01:59:06,560 --> 01:59:07,420 out of their back pockets 2158 01:59:07,420 --> 01:59:08,880 when things weren't going pretty well. 2159 01:59:08,940 --> 01:59:12,060 And they have gone to 32 counties on this island 2160 01:59:12,060 --> 01:59:13,120 to children's charities. 2161 01:59:13,500 --> 01:59:14,520 It is a beautiful thing. 2162 01:59:14,600 --> 01:59:15,040 Thank you, Mr Toby. 2163 01:59:15,040 --> 01:59:15,820 And thank you to the Irish people. 2164 01:59:15,960 --> 01:59:16,900 I'm now moving on. 2165 01:59:16,900 --> 01:59:19,140 I'm calling on Deputy Matty McGrath. 2166 01:59:19,240 --> 01:59:20,100 Please, the floor is yours. 2167 01:59:20,180 --> 01:59:20,780 You have 10 minutes. 2168 01:59:20,980 --> 01:59:23,720 I'm delighted to meet you upstairs. 2169 01:59:24,060 --> 01:59:25,660 I'm in the cup, Ryan, 2170 01:59:25,900 --> 01:59:27,540 and you asked me with the badge, 2171 01:59:27,620 --> 01:59:30,800 and your late granddad was with Lee mentioned. 2172 01:59:31,140 --> 01:59:32,460 And as was your father, obviously. 2173 01:59:32,500 --> 01:59:32,860 Yeah, Lee. 2174 01:59:33,220 --> 01:59:35,600 And look, sometimes, if you're out of a job Friday, 2175 01:59:35,880 --> 01:59:37,240 which you seem to think you might be, 2176 01:59:37,620 --> 01:59:39,660 be welcome down to retrace the footsteps 2177 01:59:39,660 --> 01:59:40,600 and maybe make a film. 2178 01:59:40,980 --> 01:59:41,600 Can you hear us? 2179 01:59:41,680 --> 01:59:42,740 Yes, of course. 2180 01:59:42,860 --> 01:59:43,840 Come on, use your time wisely. 2181 01:59:44,000 --> 01:59:44,460 Come on, have 10 minutes. 2182 01:59:44,460 --> 01:59:45,780 I'm taking the opportunity, Buster. 2183 01:59:45,900 --> 01:59:46,160 Look at... 2184 01:59:46,160 --> 01:59:46,760 Can that be? 2185 01:59:46,840 --> 01:59:47,440 We're here now. 2186 01:59:47,640 --> 01:59:48,320 Welcome our guests. 2187 01:59:48,320 --> 01:59:49,140 As you can, of course. 2188 01:59:49,220 --> 01:59:49,880 Welcome our guests. 2189 01:59:50,400 --> 01:59:51,740 and thank you for coming in. 2190 01:59:52,400 --> 01:59:55,180 Mr Kelly, regarding the invices made out to ASTOS, 2191 01:59:55,440 --> 01:59:58,400 is it really legitimate for us to expect... 2192 01:59:58,400 --> 02:00:00,060 Are you to expect that we're understanding 2193 02:00:00,060 --> 02:00:04,260 the reasons why you were advised to make false invices 2194 02:00:04,260 --> 02:00:07,100 out to ASTOS? 2195 02:00:07,560 --> 02:00:10,840 And do you find being asked to submit an invite to ASTOS 2196 02:00:10,840 --> 02:00:12,000 as unusual? 2197 02:00:15,440 --> 02:00:18,500 I think, as I said, with the antenna up now, 2198 02:00:18,820 --> 02:00:20,100 you'd certainly question at the time, 2199 02:00:20,100 --> 02:00:21,580 we didn't question anything. 2200 02:00:21,940 --> 02:00:23,380 It was an instruction from RTA. 2201 02:00:24,680 --> 02:00:25,540 Thank you very much there. 2202 02:00:25,940 --> 02:00:27,720 Translucent Tuberty and Paul Meschel 2203 02:00:27,720 --> 02:00:30,800 and 9-11 Airlines and Richard Boyd Barrett. 2204 02:00:30,920 --> 02:00:31,620 Thank you very much. 2205 02:00:32,020 --> 02:00:32,680 Accounts in the past? 2206 02:00:32,780 --> 02:00:33,240 No, never. 2207 02:00:33,600 --> 02:00:33,820 Never. 2208 02:00:34,280 --> 02:00:34,500 Okay. 2209 02:00:35,060 --> 02:00:36,460 Mr Kelly, how many companies have you 2210 02:00:36,460 --> 02:00:39,440 that you use to invoice RTA for Mr Tuberty's salary? 2211 02:00:39,800 --> 02:00:41,020 I have two companies 2212 02:00:41,020 --> 02:00:46,580 and Mr Tuberty's accountant's invoice for RTA. 2213 02:00:46,580 --> 02:00:47,580 I have two companies. 2214 02:00:47,580 --> 02:00:47,860 I have two companies. 2215 02:00:47,860 --> 02:00:47,960 I have two companies. 2216 02:00:47,960 --> 02:00:48,860 I have two companies. 2217 02:00:48,860 --> 02:00:55,560 And do you now accept, Mr Kelly, that you created false invoices, even if RTA asked you to do so? 2218 02:00:56,060 --> 02:01:00,820 This is actually complicity in a potential financial fraud crime aiding and abetting? 2219 02:01:01,300 --> 02:01:04,780 We didn't raise any false invoices. 2220 02:01:04,780 --> 02:01:07,420 We just raised exactly what was asked of us by RTA. 2221 02:01:08,020 --> 02:01:11,340 But we now know that they weren't legitimate, they were different. 2222 02:01:12,460 --> 02:01:15,480 At all times we thought, Renault were paying the invoices. 2223 02:01:15,480 --> 02:01:18,840 Renault paid the first one and our assumption was that Renault were paying the other ones. 2224 02:01:18,840 --> 02:01:22,980 But again, it was always under instruction. 2225 02:01:23,760 --> 02:01:29,160 Why would the invoice be made out by a sister company, CMS, instead of MKA Management, 2226 02:01:29,680 --> 02:01:32,600 and addressed to a UK company in Estes? 2227 02:01:33,080 --> 02:01:37,780 And which company accounts are these payments reflected? 2228 02:01:38,180 --> 02:01:47,620 Sure. We invoice, both companies could invoice each other, as in NK or CMS. 2229 02:01:47,620 --> 02:01:50,760 Asked us again, was under instruction from RTA. 2230 02:01:50,760 --> 02:01:53,060 So you just took your instructions lightly. 2231 02:01:53,740 --> 02:02:00,080 And one, who exactly in RTA requested you, requested the false invoices, 2232 02:02:00,560 --> 02:02:02,340 be switched to another RTA company? 2233 02:02:03,200 --> 02:02:07,760 That was page 25 from commercial. 2234 02:02:07,760 --> 02:02:13,500 And why was it not an old Cali company so willing to create false invoices? 2235 02:02:14,040 --> 02:02:17,860 Has anybody ever been paid by CMS in the past? 2236 02:02:18,980 --> 02:02:19,860 He could have been, yeah. 2237 02:02:20,240 --> 02:02:25,980 He could have been for, it could have been a CMS event or an NK event, it would depend. 2238 02:02:26,600 --> 02:02:27,040 Could have been. 2239 02:02:27,660 --> 02:02:29,660 And they would go to his company? 2240 02:02:29,660 --> 02:02:36,520 Why was it necessary for false invoices to be switched to another newly created company? 2241 02:02:37,520 --> 02:02:44,740 Again, it was under instruction from RTA to send the invoice as stated. 2242 02:02:46,040 --> 02:02:49,220 Can I ask, Mr Kelly, are you fully tax compliant now? 2243 02:02:49,280 --> 02:02:49,800 Completely. 2244 02:02:50,160 --> 02:02:50,600 Completely. 2245 02:02:51,080 --> 02:02:51,780 Always have been. 2246 02:02:51,780 --> 02:02:58,920 Could I further ask to the Chair, have you ever had arrangements with offshore companies to keep a tax? 2247 02:02:58,920 --> 02:02:59,420 No. 2248 02:02:59,420 --> 02:02:59,540 Not at all. 2249 02:02:59,540 --> 02:03:00,040 Not at all. 2250 02:03:00,040 --> 02:03:01,540 We are a small company. 2251 02:03:02,960 --> 02:03:05,920 We are not RTA, 350 million, we are a small company. 2252 02:03:06,920 --> 02:03:07,360 Okay. 2253 02:03:07,860 --> 02:03:09,060 That's your answer. 2254 02:03:09,920 --> 02:03:22,260 Mr Tuberty, I mean, do you now have, you know, full faith and full confidence in Mr Kelly's, to continue to be your agent after all, has come out at this stage? 2255 02:03:22,540 --> 02:03:23,220 Yes, I do. 2256 02:03:23,480 --> 02:03:25,060 I think that he's explained himself. 2257 02:03:25,060 --> 02:03:32,080 I think he has, at all times, produced a paper trail where it was necessary. 2258 02:03:32,380 --> 02:03:36,640 So, yes, he's always been, had my back in the 20 years we've worked together. 2259 02:03:36,800 --> 02:03:39,040 So, I have no reason to say anything other than that. 2260 02:03:39,400 --> 02:03:46,140 But, like, we're trying to create a new, get everything out and do open, start off, with respect to all the employees and RT and all the listeners. 2261 02:03:46,340 --> 02:03:46,580 Yes. 2262 02:03:46,580 --> 02:03:48,100 I mean, people out there don't. 2263 02:03:48,280 --> 02:03:54,260 So, I mean, by you endorsing Mr Kelly now, it's very hard for people to understand that. 2264 02:03:54,700 --> 02:03:57,160 I thought, Schnuffles, thank you very much. 2265 02:03:57,200 --> 02:03:57,900 I'll beat your rest. 2266 02:03:58,140 --> 02:03:58,460 Sorry, sorry. 2267 02:03:58,720 --> 02:04:00,500 Again, my mic coming in hot. 2268 02:04:00,680 --> 02:04:03,760 There's a lot of moving parts to this production that you're watching. 2269 02:04:04,320 --> 02:04:05,340 It's not a big budget. 2270 02:04:05,620 --> 02:04:07,880 It's definitely, look, there's a lot of conferring going on. 2271 02:04:07,940 --> 02:04:09,520 A lot of whispering going on there, look. 2272 02:04:20,740 --> 02:04:22,340 Things that weren't supposed to be. 2273 02:04:22,380 --> 02:04:22,940 What do you call that? 2274 02:04:23,480 --> 02:04:24,660 From under instruction. 2275 02:04:24,660 --> 02:04:26,040 I thought, no, sorry. 2276 02:04:27,040 --> 02:04:28,920 Yet again, I just came in hot again. 2277 02:04:29,700 --> 02:04:32,320 These guys are getting a fucking easy ride. 2278 02:04:32,560 --> 02:04:34,880 We need, time is running out here. 2279 02:04:34,980 --> 02:04:35,780 It's done at six. 2280 02:04:36,140 --> 02:04:37,180 They've got 40 minutes. 2281 02:04:37,540 --> 02:04:40,200 This is like a filibuster sort of thing for these guys. 2282 02:04:40,320 --> 02:04:41,180 They're grand with this. 2283 02:04:41,300 --> 02:04:42,860 They want to keep Matty asking questions. 2284 02:04:43,120 --> 02:04:44,740 I thought Matty was going to come in hot. 2285 02:04:45,000 --> 02:04:46,240 He's not, unfortunately. 2286 02:04:46,520 --> 02:04:47,540 He's going smooth with them. 2287 02:04:47,540 --> 02:04:49,860 Mr. Covey, who do you work for? 2288 02:04:50,260 --> 02:04:54,160 I mean, why do you work for RT via the sole trader? 2289 02:04:54,420 --> 02:04:55,600 Yeah, it's a fair question. 2290 02:04:55,960 --> 02:04:56,740 It's a fair question. 2291 02:04:56,960 --> 02:05:06,940 As I recall it, RT along the way decided that people like me, whatever that means, working at a certain level within the organization. 2292 02:05:06,940 --> 02:05:10,300 It doesn't make you better than anyone else, but just makes you probably better paid for sure. 2293 02:05:11,900 --> 02:05:13,540 I think they wanted us. 2294 02:05:13,600 --> 02:05:13,960 Is that right? 2295 02:05:14,060 --> 02:05:14,960 To go sole trader. 2296 02:05:15,620 --> 02:05:24,740 So this is not, sorry to say, this is not my wheelhouse in terms of detail, but that's what they said, go sole trader, and I did. 2297 02:05:25,080 --> 02:05:30,920 And I'm in a position where my tool in life is words, and it's never been good with numbers and so forth. 2298 02:05:30,980 --> 02:05:38,480 So I have an accountant, I pay him, and I have an agent, I pay him, and I kind of hope that they put it all together for me, and they have so far. 2299 02:05:39,860 --> 02:05:48,000 We all have, Mr. Toppery, we all have private business and accountants, and we sit down and we have to answer all the questions and be sure. 2300 02:05:48,000 --> 02:05:49,240 Oh, I know, that's why I'm here. 2301 02:05:49,660 --> 02:05:50,400 I asked to be here. 2302 02:05:50,600 --> 02:05:54,300 I know, but in returning our accounts annually, we have to do it. 2303 02:05:54,320 --> 02:05:55,320 Oh, yeah, well, as I... 2304 02:05:55,320 --> 02:05:57,820 We don't get a chance to go before any committee to... 2305 02:05:57,820 --> 02:05:58,260 No, no. 2306 02:05:58,500 --> 02:05:59,480 ...to address the nation. 2307 02:05:59,660 --> 02:06:00,200 No, I appreciate that. 2308 02:06:00,220 --> 02:06:00,620 But anyway, you're here. 2309 02:06:00,840 --> 02:06:00,960 Yeah. 2310 02:06:01,340 --> 02:06:08,860 Can I ask you, Mr. Toppery, what are the typical tax benefits of working for RT via production company, as you are? 2311 02:06:08,860 --> 02:06:11,560 Or, I don't know, it's all trade or... 2312 02:06:11,560 --> 02:06:14,720 Again, do you know the answer, or is that an accountant's question? 2313 02:06:14,720 --> 02:06:15,240 Again... 2314 02:06:15,240 --> 02:06:15,800 Sorry, David. 2315 02:06:16,240 --> 02:06:16,500 Sorry. 2316 02:06:16,860 --> 02:06:21,340 Again, it's all independent contractors sell hours of service. 2317 02:06:21,660 --> 02:06:27,060 As Ryan said, 205 hours of radio, 38 two-hour-plus shows on the late, late show. 2318 02:06:27,780 --> 02:06:29,300 And that's what they're selling. 2319 02:06:29,440 --> 02:06:29,740 They're trying. 2320 02:06:29,820 --> 02:06:31,280 They're independent contractors. 2321 02:06:32,040 --> 02:06:32,860 They've no... 2322 02:06:32,860 --> 02:06:34,000 They've no union. 2323 02:06:34,000 --> 02:06:34,880 Independent contractors. 2324 02:06:35,700 --> 02:06:36,300 They have you. 2325 02:06:37,040 --> 02:06:37,640 They have me. 2326 02:06:38,000 --> 02:06:38,320 Superman. 2327 02:06:38,320 --> 02:06:38,400 Superman. 2328 02:06:38,560 --> 02:06:39,900 No, they have me. 2329 02:06:40,320 --> 02:06:40,620 All right. 2330 02:06:40,720 --> 02:06:40,920 Okay. 2331 02:06:41,160 --> 02:06:41,560 Sorry, David. 2332 02:06:41,580 --> 02:06:42,520 I'll just say... 2333 02:06:42,520 --> 02:06:43,020 And I... 2334 02:06:43,020 --> 02:06:47,460 Again, it's all independent contractors sell hours of service. 2335 02:06:47,840 --> 02:06:49,280 As Ryan said, 205 hours. 2336 02:06:49,420 --> 02:06:50,500 The typical tax benefits. 2337 02:06:51,120 --> 02:06:52,620 What are the typical tax benefits? 2338 02:06:53,100 --> 02:06:55,380 Sorry to stretch the credibility, but it's a matter of fact. 2339 02:06:55,620 --> 02:06:58,120 And I will also say what knows that they're about duty of care. 2340 02:06:58,500 --> 02:07:02,160 He actually cares about my head and my... 2341 02:07:02,160 --> 02:07:05,420 How I'm feeling about the world, despite everything, in a way that... 2342 02:07:05,420 --> 02:07:06,040 I appreciate that. 2343 02:07:06,100 --> 02:07:06,620 Totally all. 2344 02:07:06,720 --> 02:07:07,940 I know it's not that. 2345 02:07:07,940 --> 02:07:07,940 I... 2346 02:07:07,940 --> 02:07:08,360 Okay. 2347 02:07:08,580 --> 02:07:09,540 There's not a lynch mob here. 2348 02:07:09,780 --> 02:07:10,340 That's true. 2349 02:07:10,420 --> 02:07:10,880 We all do. 2350 02:07:11,000 --> 02:07:11,760 I know that. 2351 02:07:11,900 --> 02:07:15,160 I wouldn't invite myself before a lynch mob. 2352 02:07:15,220 --> 02:07:15,920 I know it's not that at all. 2353 02:07:15,920 --> 02:07:17,660 I fully respect what's happening here. 2354 02:07:17,720 --> 02:07:23,920 But I just feel sometimes that there's an issue with people's health. 2355 02:07:23,980 --> 02:07:27,560 When a company's accounts are signed off, people have to take responsibility for the accounts, 2356 02:07:27,800 --> 02:07:29,940 notwithstanding what their accountant tells them. 2357 02:07:30,020 --> 02:07:35,140 You have to know everybody's in this is right, as proper, and before yourself and your maker. 2358 02:07:35,680 --> 02:07:36,680 Mr. Trouble, could I ask you? 2359 02:07:37,240 --> 02:07:39,020 I do value my children. 2360 02:07:39,020 --> 02:07:40,460 I'm granted and love the Thai show. 2361 02:07:40,460 --> 02:07:45,020 I did have one issue during the COVID with the whole Pfizer job. 2362 02:07:45,100 --> 02:07:46,720 The child being used in that way. 2363 02:07:46,920 --> 02:07:51,260 I thought it was horrific to sell Pfizer or promote them. 2364 02:07:51,800 --> 02:07:54,920 Do you have any benefit in financial or otherwise from Pfizer? 2365 02:07:56,240 --> 02:07:57,740 Deputy, not in the slightest. 2366 02:07:57,900 --> 02:08:05,140 Actually, that was all done in a way that was not meant to be political or scientific. 2367 02:08:05,440 --> 02:08:07,220 It was just on its day. 2368 02:08:07,400 --> 02:08:09,420 It's meant to be satirical, frankly. 2369 02:08:09,920 --> 02:08:12,120 So, no, never got a benefit from Pfizer, no. 2370 02:08:12,700 --> 02:08:12,920 Never? 2371 02:08:13,320 --> 02:08:13,700 Never. 2372 02:08:14,200 --> 02:08:14,640 Never. 2373 02:08:15,040 --> 02:08:16,280 RT just got on to benefits. 2374 02:08:17,300 --> 02:08:17,460 Okay. 2375 02:08:17,780 --> 02:08:19,300 You can toss them that on Thursday. 2376 02:08:19,640 --> 02:08:20,000 I accept. 2377 02:08:20,180 --> 02:08:20,940 We have a reaction. 2378 02:08:21,100 --> 02:08:22,900 We had to get answers out of them in fairness. 2379 02:08:22,920 --> 02:08:23,680 But that's a different story. 2380 02:08:23,700 --> 02:08:24,140 We have more forthcoming. 2381 02:08:24,380 --> 02:08:25,160 Well, I appreciate that. 2382 02:08:25,180 --> 02:08:27,180 I mean, look, in all that's gone on since now. 2383 02:08:27,300 --> 02:08:27,660 Pfizer. 2384 02:08:27,880 --> 02:08:30,020 As I said, the fiduciary duties at the board, many more gone now. 2385 02:08:30,260 --> 02:08:30,500 Yes. 2386 02:08:30,620 --> 02:08:32,040 Like, all wasn't well. 2387 02:08:32,040 --> 02:08:32,320 Pfizer. 2388 02:08:32,560 --> 02:08:33,940 I mean, how does that? 2389 02:08:34,280 --> 02:08:36,180 You're participating in a fraud, man. 2390 02:08:36,220 --> 02:08:38,740 You're getting a lot of criticism and all that. 2391 02:08:39,140 --> 02:08:42,880 And I'm delighted that you're getting so many calves of goodwill, and we wish you goodwill. 2392 02:08:43,060 --> 02:08:43,840 I appreciate that. 2393 02:08:43,840 --> 02:08:44,160 You have had your father. 2394 02:08:44,160 --> 02:08:49,280 It's been a very difficult three weeks, and it's been, I know, life is hard for a lot of people in Ireland. 2395 02:08:49,400 --> 02:08:51,660 I'm not trying to be any more special than anyone else. 2396 02:08:51,720 --> 02:08:55,240 But when you're publicly cancelled the way I've been, it has not been easy. 2397 02:08:56,040 --> 02:08:58,060 I can appreciate that, and your family as well. 2398 02:08:58,140 --> 02:08:58,560 I appreciate it. 2399 02:08:58,560 --> 02:09:00,540 And we send their good wishes to them, as I said. 2400 02:09:00,860 --> 02:09:07,480 But it's people out there during that time, especially with suffering such huge cuts to their income. 2401 02:09:07,860 --> 02:09:09,480 This is a small business, especially wiped out. 2402 02:09:09,960 --> 02:09:10,360 Wiped out. 2403 02:09:10,480 --> 02:09:11,360 I totally understand that. 2404 02:09:11,360 --> 02:09:11,800 It's some bad work. 2405 02:09:12,360 --> 02:09:14,680 The fact that they weren't getting the proper... 2406 02:09:14,680 --> 02:09:18,680 Are you sorry now that you didn't break the place and have published... 2407 02:09:18,680 --> 02:09:21,580 This is fucking soft, old shite, man. 2408 02:09:21,980 --> 02:09:24,900 You need to bring it back to the fucking werewolves. 2409 02:09:26,020 --> 02:09:27,320 There's only half an hour left. 2410 02:09:27,460 --> 02:09:28,580 Like, where's the werewolves? 2411 02:09:28,640 --> 02:09:29,320 I said that, yeah. 2412 02:09:29,700 --> 02:09:30,420 I'm sorry about that. 2413 02:09:30,880 --> 02:09:31,580 Should have said something. 2414 02:09:32,200 --> 02:09:32,600 Yeah. 2415 02:09:33,040 --> 02:09:33,600 What did he say? 2416 02:09:33,840 --> 02:09:34,120 Deputy. 2417 02:09:34,960 --> 02:09:37,040 Ian, I appreciate that you put your hands up. 2418 02:09:37,220 --> 02:09:37,640 I missed you. 2419 02:09:37,740 --> 02:09:42,160 As I said, so you still have full confidence on Mr Kelly. 2420 02:09:42,260 --> 02:09:42,620 Yes, I do. 2421 02:09:42,640 --> 02:09:43,120 He's my friend. 2422 02:09:43,860 --> 02:09:44,880 And I appreciate that. 2423 02:09:45,000 --> 02:09:47,040 I don't expect your pictures to be upset. 2424 02:09:47,540 --> 02:09:53,160 But on a human level, I think I find it very hard to accept, like, for the false invoices. 2425 02:09:53,340 --> 02:09:56,600 They were not invoices for the properties that they were there. 2426 02:09:57,040 --> 02:10:00,760 They were created by different companies and change a separate company again. 2427 02:10:01,300 --> 02:10:03,080 And that is not standard practice for anybody. 2428 02:10:03,280 --> 02:10:04,500 You couldn't buy a truck like that. 2429 02:10:04,720 --> 02:10:07,180 As somebody else said, you have to get an invoice for a truck. 2430 02:10:07,500 --> 02:10:11,040 Not for a dunking cart or something like that. 2431 02:10:11,040 --> 02:10:12,980 It has to be a truck. 2432 02:10:13,360 --> 02:10:14,520 All under instruction. 2433 02:10:15,360 --> 02:10:16,320 Thank you, Deputy McGrath. 2434 02:10:16,340 --> 02:10:20,320 You can't use that instruction to be just, ask no questions. 2435 02:10:20,540 --> 02:10:20,980 What is this? 2436 02:10:21,300 --> 02:10:23,060 Hear no evil, see no evil, speak no evil. 2437 02:10:23,320 --> 02:10:27,220 You have to have some idea. 2438 02:10:27,400 --> 02:10:28,500 You have to trust, Deputy. 2439 02:10:28,700 --> 02:10:29,380 You have to trust. 2440 02:10:29,600 --> 02:10:30,320 Yeah, but sure. 2441 02:10:30,620 --> 02:10:32,460 We know now where the trust is gone. 2442 02:10:32,660 --> 02:10:34,000 I know, and it's easy to know. 2443 02:10:34,000 --> 02:10:35,800 And the licensing players and their trust. 2444 02:10:35,820 --> 02:10:36,620 It's easy to know now. 2445 02:10:37,000 --> 02:10:37,860 Yeah, but you can't. 2446 02:10:37,860 --> 02:10:40,100 You don't in business take everybody at their own. 2447 02:10:40,100 --> 02:10:42,480 Because you have to be sure you can send it up. 2448 02:10:42,860 --> 02:10:45,020 Thank you, Deputy McGrath. 2449 02:10:45,020 --> 02:10:45,020 Thank you, Deputy McGrath. 2450 02:10:45,020 --> 02:10:47,940 And I appreciate your clarity with your questions. 2451 02:10:47,940 --> 02:10:48,440 Fuck, man. 2452 02:10:48,500 --> 02:10:50,120 Come on, get some werewolves in there. 2453 02:10:50,340 --> 02:10:50,920 Is that okay? 2454 02:10:51,160 --> 02:10:51,700 You conclude? 2455 02:10:51,940 --> 02:10:52,840 Thank you very much. 2456 02:10:53,120 --> 02:10:54,020 Get some werewolves. 2457 02:10:54,140 --> 02:10:57,300 We want a pack of fucking blood-hungry bloodhounds. 2458 02:10:57,300 --> 02:10:59,200 Welcome to both of the witnesses. 2459 02:10:59,720 --> 02:11:08,880 Starting with the raising of the two invoices in 2022 by you, Mr. Kelly, to the barter company and the report of Grant Thornton. 2460 02:11:09,300 --> 02:11:15,120 The document states that you said that you had spoken to the commercial director about year two of the five-year contract. 2461 02:11:15,420 --> 02:11:16,880 But she said that it was not her problem. 2462 02:11:17,060 --> 02:11:19,580 And you said that it was not yours either. 2463 02:11:19,700 --> 02:11:21,480 And that they should now have to come up with solutions. 2464 02:11:21,860 --> 02:11:24,460 Why were you chasing money? 2465 02:11:24,460 --> 02:11:28,060 Thanks very much there, Say Tony and Schnuppels. 2466 02:11:28,280 --> 02:11:29,060 Thank you very much. 2467 02:11:29,140 --> 02:11:30,200 Not yet completed the work. 2468 02:11:30,940 --> 02:11:32,340 Because the... 2469 02:11:32,340 --> 02:11:33,220 I'm sorry. 2470 02:11:33,340 --> 02:11:33,700 It's gone. 2471 02:11:33,780 --> 02:11:37,260 It's gone kind of fucking lead balloonish here now. 2472 02:11:37,260 --> 02:11:46,480 The appearances, the shows, the late, late shows in dealerships were supposed to have happened in 2021, 22, 23, 24. 2473 02:11:47,260 --> 02:11:50,040 As I said, with COVID, the first that only happened in 2022. 2474 02:11:50,040 --> 02:11:54,160 And I know that that is referred to in page five. 2475 02:11:54,160 --> 02:12:02,440 But the reality is that there was €150,000 in transactions credited eventually to Tuttle for work that was not done. 2476 02:12:02,800 --> 02:12:05,640 I know, but there are six events owed. 2477 02:12:05,740 --> 02:12:08,300 As I already said, you know, we're still in common. 2478 02:12:08,300 --> 02:12:08,540 Okay. 2479 02:12:08,760 --> 02:12:09,300 Well, I just... 2480 02:12:09,300 --> 02:12:10,320 That's okay. 2481 02:12:10,380 --> 02:12:15,080 But I grew up in a world where, you know, you only paid money for things that you actually received. 2482 02:12:15,340 --> 02:12:22,600 So from your perspective, Ryan, did you not feel that if, you know, this didn't sit well, that you paid €150,000 in your account for work that was not yet done? 2483 02:12:22,600 --> 02:12:31,800 What sat with me and the reason I can make this clear for you today and the reason I wanted to be here for you today is that I can say that there were six appearances outstanding somewhere. 2484 02:12:32,180 --> 02:12:36,740 And I'm still ready, willing, prepared to make those appearances and come good on the... 2485 02:12:36,740 --> 02:12:37,020 Okay. 2486 02:12:37,740 --> 02:12:37,920 Okay. 2487 02:12:38,060 --> 02:12:51,040 Listening to the evidence this morning, Ryan, you and Mr. Kelly have sought to separate two items of your contract with RT for the Late Show and your morning show as a contract for those earnings. 2488 02:12:51,240 --> 02:12:57,080 And then the tripartite deal, which both yourself and Mr. Kelly have said contract for your services. 2489 02:12:58,500 --> 02:13:00,820 And that that's not linked to this basic pay. 2490 02:13:01,020 --> 02:13:02,200 Is that a fair assessment? 2491 02:13:02,520 --> 02:13:02,640 Okay. 2492 02:13:03,080 --> 02:13:10,880 And Ryan, you have said that the difference is then perception, the perception of that income for the other job. 2493 02:13:11,120 --> 02:13:12,400 But this goes to the heart of the matter. 2494 02:13:12,500 --> 02:13:13,040 Well, reality. 2495 02:13:13,100 --> 02:13:14,460 Well, this goes to the heart of the matter. 2496 02:13:14,460 --> 02:13:25,300 Because earlier, Mr. Kelly stated that the motivation was one where RT were attempting to keep the primary sponsor, Renault, to keep them on board, keep them locked in. 2497 02:13:25,860 --> 02:13:28,360 But RTE's take is much different on this. 2498 02:13:28,460 --> 02:13:36,460 Because Mr. Adrian Lynch stated in his evidence to this committee on June 28, and I quote, that in autumn 2019, negotiations were ongoing. 2499 02:13:36,900 --> 02:13:41,380 The negotiations were obviously not going that well or whatever. 2500 02:13:41,820 --> 02:13:50,000 And then this idea, the commercial deal, was obviously generated that there would be some brand extensions and there would be events, end quote. 2501 02:13:50,520 --> 02:13:54,820 So from RTE's perspective, the negotiations, Ryan, and your pay were not going well. 2502 02:13:55,420 --> 02:13:56,240 That's Mr. Adrian Lynch. 2503 02:13:56,240 --> 02:13:57,300 He said they weren't going well. 2504 02:13:57,980 --> 02:14:00,300 And that there was a problem. 2505 02:14:01,480 --> 02:14:09,300 And I would ask you, were you refusing to sign that deal until the commercial aspect was introduced into the negotiation? 2506 02:14:09,660 --> 02:14:09,800 No. 2507 02:14:10,260 --> 02:14:13,380 I immediately put that to the person doing all the negotiating. 2508 02:14:13,520 --> 02:14:13,720 No. 2509 02:14:14,580 --> 02:14:26,120 In the end of the 19 deal, again, if this was about trying to strong arm somebody, Ryan had taken a pay cut of 525,000 for the next contract. 2510 02:14:26,120 --> 02:14:27,420 So it wasn't about that. 2511 02:14:27,500 --> 02:14:29,040 This initiative came from RTE. 2512 02:14:29,040 --> 02:14:30,320 That goes back to what you said earlier. 2513 02:14:30,820 --> 02:14:35,520 You keep referring to this, Mr. Kelly, as Ryan had waived 120,000. 2514 02:14:35,620 --> 02:14:36,720 He had taken half a million. 2515 02:14:37,100 --> 02:14:39,840 My perception is that you said, Ryan, enough is enough. 2516 02:14:39,920 --> 02:14:41,020 He's taken enough pay cuts. 2517 02:14:41,500 --> 02:14:47,660 And that, as Mr. Lynch has said, there were issues here where we can't get the deal over the line. 2518 02:14:48,320 --> 02:14:51,080 And this deal was stalled until this was introduced. 2519 02:14:51,280 --> 02:14:52,720 That is clear from the negotiations. 2520 02:14:53,320 --> 02:14:54,120 It's not true. 2521 02:14:54,120 --> 02:14:55,960 But it's clear from the negotiations. 2522 02:14:56,300 --> 02:14:56,940 It's a reality. 2523 02:14:57,140 --> 02:14:59,800 Mr. Lynch said the negotiations were stalled in autumn 2019. 2524 02:15:00,340 --> 02:15:07,160 And that six days before Christmas, we have a situation where things are now moving again because of the creation of the deal. 2525 02:15:07,800 --> 02:15:09,520 No, this is an RTE initiative. 2526 02:15:09,520 --> 02:15:11,460 Yeah, I'm not buying that for you. 2527 02:15:11,540 --> 02:15:14,380 Everything today has been about RTE and an RTE initiative. 2528 02:15:14,760 --> 02:15:16,140 The reality is. 2529 02:15:16,520 --> 02:15:25,540 And so let's move to the emails from Brito O'Keefe to yourself because she talks about meeting you halfway and the fees and so forth. 2530 02:15:25,800 --> 02:15:28,020 And that's point number one in the contract discussions. 2531 02:15:28,160 --> 02:15:40,080 But point number two is quite clearly the 75,000 euro from a commercial relationship where she says we have progressed discussions with a third party and look forward to discussing this with you in more detail next Tuesday. 2532 02:15:40,560 --> 02:15:43,920 The commercial deal is central to everything. 2533 02:15:44,520 --> 02:15:47,420 It wasn't going anywhere until this was on the page. 2534 02:15:48,420 --> 02:15:48,680 Sure. 2535 02:15:48,900 --> 02:15:50,660 Let me just go to the page. 2536 02:15:50,900 --> 02:15:51,540 Page seven. 2537 02:15:51,760 --> 02:15:52,900 Contract discussions. 2538 02:15:53,120 --> 02:15:53,660 Item two. 2539 02:15:55,420 --> 02:15:55,680 That. 2540 02:15:58,060 --> 02:15:58,740 Sorry. 2541 02:15:59,780 --> 02:15:59,980 That. 2542 02:16:00,540 --> 02:16:01,300 Contract discussions. 2543 02:16:01,780 --> 02:16:06,820 The email on page five came from Miss O'Keefe. 2544 02:16:07,080 --> 02:16:07,300 Yes. 2545 02:16:07,820 --> 02:16:09,620 So they're setting out. 2546 02:16:09,980 --> 02:16:10,620 They're setting out. 2547 02:16:10,720 --> 02:16:14,840 But the point being that Mr. Lynch has said that negotiations were stalled. 2548 02:16:15,160 --> 02:16:20,660 Miss O'Keefe is setting out the key components for agreeing this deal. 2549 02:16:20,740 --> 02:16:24,380 She uses the phrase we are keen to retain Ryan's services. 2550 02:16:24,780 --> 02:16:29,020 This was a key point of negotiations was this offer of the 75,000. 2551 02:16:29,200 --> 02:16:31,180 You keep referring to the basic pay. 2552 02:16:31,680 --> 02:16:32,840 The basic pay is one thing. 2553 02:16:33,080 --> 02:16:35,120 The deal wasn't happening without the 75,000. 2554 02:16:35,120 --> 02:16:38,420 And Ryan, you have said that, but I think in terms of perception. 2555 02:16:38,980 --> 02:16:40,620 But we're dancing on the head of a pin here. 2556 02:16:40,940 --> 02:16:41,260 We're dancing on the head of a pin. 2557 02:16:41,260 --> 02:16:43,540 It was still cumulatively paid to you. 2558 02:16:43,820 --> 02:16:46,580 No matter what way it was then allocated into your accounts. 2559 02:16:46,880 --> 02:16:50,020 It was part of the negotiation deal for you to sign the contract. 2560 02:16:50,260 --> 02:16:50,980 Do you accept that? 2561 02:16:51,180 --> 02:16:52,400 That's not what I'm... 2562 02:16:52,400 --> 02:16:53,820 Hang on a second. 2563 02:16:53,960 --> 02:16:54,700 In terms of... 2564 02:16:54,700 --> 02:16:55,880 It's on the document. 2565 02:16:56,220 --> 02:16:59,680 It says in terms of them trying to negotiate and progress the negotiations. 2566 02:16:59,680 --> 02:17:02,800 Point two, we are progressing the discussions with a third party. 2567 02:17:03,060 --> 02:17:05,020 We're offering the 75,000 euro to you. 2568 02:17:07,540 --> 02:17:12,160 So are you accepting that that was a key component of making sure that you signed the contract? 2569 02:17:12,600 --> 02:17:13,560 You signed the contract. 2570 02:17:13,960 --> 02:17:14,120 Yes. 2571 02:17:14,120 --> 02:17:18,420 Was it a key component of making sure that this deal got over the line was the 75,000 euro? 2572 02:17:18,480 --> 02:17:20,140 That's not my understanding at all. 2573 02:17:20,360 --> 02:17:20,420 No. 2574 02:17:20,420 --> 02:17:21,100 That's not his understanding. 2575 02:17:21,100 --> 02:17:21,580 So, okay, so... 2576 02:17:21,580 --> 02:17:24,040 The contract is... 2577 02:17:24,040 --> 02:17:28,000 The deal with RTE was for radio and TV services. 2578 02:17:28,220 --> 02:17:28,400 Yeah. 2579 02:17:28,640 --> 02:17:32,020 For 38 late-night shows of two hours, 205 radio shows. 2580 02:17:32,260 --> 02:17:33,540 That's what the contract with RTE was. 2581 02:17:34,120 --> 02:17:37,800 And RTE then, I'm assuming to keep the sponsor, wanted Ryan to... 2582 02:17:37,800 --> 02:17:39,080 No, but that's not what RTE are saying. 2583 02:17:39,340 --> 02:17:41,740 RTE are saying that the negotiations were stalled. 2584 02:17:42,040 --> 02:17:46,000 And that when this emanation, when they brought this on, that this helped the negotiation process. 2585 02:17:46,280 --> 02:17:47,100 And you're arguing... 2586 02:17:47,100 --> 02:17:49,260 It's a totally separate agreement. 2587 02:17:49,500 --> 02:17:53,220 Well, again, you say it's a totally separate agreement, but it's always part of the discussion. 2588 02:17:53,220 --> 02:17:55,300 Sorry, if I could bring it to page 14, please. 2589 02:17:55,500 --> 02:17:58,040 There's a lot of Stalin going on. 2590 02:17:58,140 --> 02:17:59,340 The lads are on the ropes. 2591 02:17:59,460 --> 02:18:03,020 It seems this guy here, he's given them a bit of a fucking millen. 2592 02:18:03,060 --> 02:18:04,340 And rightly so. 2593 02:18:04,480 --> 02:18:06,740 There's 28 minutes left on the clock. 2594 02:18:06,760 --> 02:18:08,640 ...reed separately to these documents. 2595 02:18:08,680 --> 02:18:09,720 It's a separate agreement. 2596 02:18:09,780 --> 02:18:10,440 Well, I don't... 2597 02:18:10,440 --> 02:18:14,780 I know you're categorising it as a separate agreement, but ultimately it's a cumulative pay. 2598 02:18:15,600 --> 02:18:17,700 Shane Castles, thank you very much. 2599 02:18:18,020 --> 02:18:20,440 And Ryan Cadbury and Iwana, thank you very much. 2600 02:18:20,440 --> 02:18:22,440 ...on the table, Ryan, at Christmas 2019. 2601 02:18:22,940 --> 02:18:29,520 Were there offers from News Talk or Virgin or BBC that your agent was also saying that this was possibly that you could look at as well? 2602 02:18:29,600 --> 02:18:30,900 I never negotiate, Senator. 2603 02:18:31,140 --> 02:18:32,240 You can ask null question. 2604 02:18:32,340 --> 02:18:32,900 He negotiates. 2605 02:18:33,000 --> 02:18:34,420 No, you have to ask the man who negotiates. 2606 02:18:34,420 --> 02:18:34,960 No, that's fine. 2607 02:18:35,100 --> 02:18:35,480 That's fine. 2608 02:18:35,540 --> 02:18:43,140 But I'll tell you, my experience in past as being a sports journalist is that, from agents, is that football agents would have agents that negotiate with clubs. 2609 02:18:43,600 --> 02:18:48,200 Don't tell me that they don't know what's being put under their contract or what club they would go to. 2610 02:18:48,440 --> 02:18:52,100 And similarly, the same applies to you in terms of whether stations are buying for you. 2611 02:18:52,260 --> 02:18:53,780 The man wasn't not talking to you. 2612 02:18:53,980 --> 02:18:54,200 Yes. 2613 02:18:54,200 --> 02:18:59,560 Were there a scenario where in Christmas 2019, News Talk or Virgin or BBC were looking for you? 2614 02:18:59,780 --> 02:19:00,080 I don't know. 2615 02:19:00,420 --> 02:19:01,200 No, no, no, no, no. 2616 02:19:01,240 --> 02:19:02,600 He would have told you. 2617 02:19:02,680 --> 02:19:02,880 Sorry. 2618 02:19:03,020 --> 02:19:03,180 Did he? 2619 02:19:03,440 --> 02:19:04,100 I'm the one who... 2620 02:19:04,100 --> 02:19:04,440 Watch out. 2621 02:19:04,480 --> 02:19:05,140 There's a fucking fire. 2622 02:19:05,140 --> 02:19:05,800 They're coming down. 2623 02:19:05,920 --> 02:19:06,100 No. 2624 02:19:06,100 --> 02:19:07,600 He's the man who eventually can put on the show. 2625 02:19:07,760 --> 02:19:08,400 So it's a fair question. 2626 02:19:08,620 --> 02:19:09,220 No, excuse me. 2627 02:19:09,300 --> 02:19:10,480 It's fair to put to him. 2628 02:19:11,740 --> 02:19:13,900 Had your agent informed you, Mr. Tuberty? 2629 02:19:13,900 --> 02:19:19,260 Had your agent informed you of any potential officers from other parties in the media sphere? 2630 02:19:20,080 --> 02:19:21,340 Not that I'm aware of at this point. 2631 02:19:21,400 --> 02:19:22,040 Not that you're aware of. 2632 02:19:22,060 --> 02:19:22,840 Mr. Caddy, were there? 2633 02:19:23,220 --> 02:19:23,360 No. 2634 02:19:23,500 --> 02:19:25,600 Did someone drop a bomb in this shit? 2635 02:19:25,840 --> 02:19:26,880 Sorry, I'm not a sports agent. 2636 02:19:26,880 --> 02:19:28,300 Because that stuff was a blast. 2637 02:19:28,620 --> 02:19:29,520 I'm not a sports agent. 2638 02:19:29,660 --> 02:19:32,820 And I can understand why a football team would be going with Man United. 2639 02:19:33,020 --> 02:19:34,480 They're asking, but he completely understands that. 2640 02:19:35,360 --> 02:19:36,840 Okay, we'll move on. 2641 02:19:38,180 --> 02:19:39,360 No, there was not... 2642 02:19:39,360 --> 02:19:40,280 The details of the contract. 2643 02:19:40,300 --> 02:19:40,440 No, no. 2644 02:19:40,680 --> 02:19:42,160 And Ryan loves RT. 2645 02:19:42,340 --> 02:19:43,400 Ryan wants to stay in RT. 2646 02:19:43,540 --> 02:19:44,120 This was... 2647 02:19:44,120 --> 02:19:45,020 If Ryan wanted to leave RT, that would be a complete separate thing. 2648 02:19:45,020 --> 02:19:46,400 Okay, I'm just finding it hard. 2649 02:19:46,500 --> 02:19:49,680 Because Ryan said this morning at PAC that, you know, he does his job. 2650 02:19:49,920 --> 02:19:51,120 No, Kelly does his job. 2651 02:19:51,460 --> 02:19:54,960 I'm just still figuring that, you know, you still read the agreement when you sign it. 2652 02:19:55,640 --> 02:19:55,900 Sure. 2653 02:19:55,900 --> 02:20:00,780 Because, you know, looking at this, Ryan, over the time since you've worked for the Late Show, 2654 02:20:00,860 --> 02:20:06,720 I think I've worked it out roughly that you've earned 8 million euro from your time as working on the Late Show. 2655 02:20:06,720 --> 02:20:16,140 And what wonders to me is why in God's name then we were chasing these speaking gigs for 75,000 euro as part of the deal to get it over the line. 2656 02:20:16,640 --> 02:20:17,120 We weren't. 2657 02:20:17,300 --> 02:20:19,760 And this was an initiative from RTE. 2658 02:20:19,920 --> 02:20:20,940 Yeah, but why? 2659 02:20:21,400 --> 02:20:23,520 Why was there a need for RTE to throw it on the table? 2660 02:20:23,820 --> 02:20:24,300 No, but why? 2661 02:20:24,300 --> 02:20:25,040 You're talking about RTE that I'm assuming is to keep the responsible. 2662 02:20:25,040 --> 02:20:28,480 I mean, were you sitting there going, Ryan, look, they're coming with 75 grand. 2663 02:20:28,640 --> 02:20:31,520 They're coming with 75 grand extra. 2664 02:20:32,620 --> 02:20:36,440 You keep saying that it's RTE that were coming with this and you weren't going looking for it. 2665 02:20:36,600 --> 02:20:42,620 But I'm finding that struggling hard to believe that when Adrian Lynch said negotiations were stalled, here they came with a bounty. 2666 02:20:42,620 --> 02:20:43,100 Can I answer the question? 2667 02:20:43,100 --> 02:20:44,980 Can I answer the question? 2668 02:20:46,340 --> 02:20:47,160 Very simple. 2669 02:20:47,840 --> 02:20:49,560 RTE came to us with this initiative. 2670 02:20:50,020 --> 02:20:53,840 I can only assume that they wanted to keep one of their biggest sponsors on board. 2671 02:20:54,180 --> 02:20:55,780 And I'm sorry, can I please finish the question? 2672 02:20:56,840 --> 02:20:58,040 Keep Ryan Troubledy on board. 2673 02:20:58,160 --> 02:21:02,300 Keeping Ryan Troubledy on board for another five years would equate to keeping a sponsor on. 2674 02:21:02,500 --> 02:21:04,340 Now Ryan Troubledy has finished the Late Show. 2675 02:21:04,860 --> 02:21:06,480 Maybe it'll be the same sort of maybe another sponsor. 2676 02:21:06,700 --> 02:21:07,280 But that's all. 2677 02:21:07,380 --> 02:21:08,360 I'm not a sports agent. 2678 02:21:08,540 --> 02:21:09,120 We don't have 10 people in the room. 2679 02:21:09,120 --> 02:21:09,280 That's fine. 2680 02:21:09,400 --> 02:21:11,380 And that has your narrative and you've held the line. 2681 02:21:11,380 --> 02:21:11,840 I'm sorry, Senator. 2682 02:21:12,100 --> 02:21:18,920 I would only look at if somebody wanted to move, if they were unhappy in the scenario that they were actually in. 2683 02:21:19,060 --> 02:21:19,500 And that's all. 2684 02:21:19,720 --> 02:21:20,620 Okay, well that's fine. 2685 02:21:20,700 --> 02:21:21,640 And you've held that narrative. 2686 02:21:21,760 --> 02:21:23,040 You've held that line all day. 2687 02:21:23,140 --> 02:21:29,640 What I'm saying is that Adrian Lynch said the negotiations were stalled and that when this was put on the table, that this progressed things on. 2688 02:21:30,100 --> 02:21:30,860 And you know, Minister... 2689 02:21:30,860 --> 02:21:32,640 And I'm going to put this to your eye, respectively. 2690 02:21:32,800 --> 02:21:36,800 Because in here, ministers blaming officials and turning to their officials doesn't wash it. 2691 02:21:36,800 --> 02:21:37,960 Because the book stops with them. 2692 02:21:38,440 --> 02:21:39,940 And they resign if there's a cock-up. 2693 02:21:40,540 --> 02:21:45,000 Fintan O'Stool. 2694 02:21:45,000 --> 02:21:46,040 Fintan O'Stool. 2695 02:21:46,360 --> 02:21:49,740 And that it was the conscience of the client as to whether the dog was called off. 2696 02:21:49,740 --> 02:21:59,160 So why did you look for that last pound of flesh when you were being paid a basic of €440,000 for these add-ons to make sure that the contract was signed? 2697 02:21:59,520 --> 02:22:00,080 I'm not a minister. 2698 02:22:00,440 --> 02:22:02,620 We're not responsible for Fintan O'Stool's commentary. 2699 02:22:02,880 --> 02:22:09,760 And I'm asking in terms of why was it necessary for the add-ons, regardless of the basic pay, was €440,000 not enough? 2700 02:22:10,240 --> 02:22:11,280 You've already explained that. 2701 02:22:11,480 --> 02:22:16,760 No, you know, I'm asking Mr. Troubly directly, and I'm entitled to ask the man himself who was being paid. 2702 02:22:17,760 --> 02:22:19,820 There's been a lot of latitude, Chairman, with the height of respect. 2703 02:22:20,160 --> 02:22:21,280 I'm asking you respectfully. 2704 02:22:21,700 --> 02:22:23,420 Was €440,000 not enough? 2705 02:22:23,500 --> 02:22:27,880 Did you not say to Mr. Kelly, I don't need the extra €75,000? 2706 02:22:28,700 --> 02:22:35,600 To use your own analogy, to use your own analogy, is €469,000. 2707 02:22:36,080 --> 02:22:38,020 €3,000 is to be thrown at it. 2708 02:22:38,020 --> 02:22:38,600 One voice, one voice. 2709 02:22:38,600 --> 02:22:46,800 To use your own analogy, would a footballer expect a decent fee for playing for his club? 2710 02:22:48,520 --> 02:22:52,420 And would the footballer have his agent negotiate a decent fee to play for his club? 2711 02:22:53,420 --> 02:22:57,940 And somebody who was a sports journalist, as you've claimed, and I presume it's true, 2712 02:22:57,940 --> 02:23:01,280 that has to be taken into consideration. 2713 02:23:01,500 --> 02:23:10,760 So with that in mind, this man negotiates my salary situation, my contract situation. 2714 02:23:11,020 --> 02:23:17,320 He is, as he said before, he minds my business, and he minds me too. 2715 02:23:17,460 --> 02:23:18,160 He's a good person. 2716 02:23:18,340 --> 02:23:19,880 He has struck a good deal. 2717 02:23:19,880 --> 02:23:21,560 But what I'm struggling with today... 2718 02:23:21,560 --> 02:23:21,940 So that's what I'm trying to say. 2719 02:23:22,120 --> 02:23:24,520 So, you know, you talk about our narrative, their narrative. 2720 02:23:24,760 --> 02:23:26,320 This is not our story. 2721 02:23:26,460 --> 02:23:26,920 This is our truth. 2722 02:23:26,940 --> 02:23:29,960 30 seconds, Senator Castles, to wrap up in 30 seconds. 2723 02:23:30,080 --> 02:23:35,520 No, quite frankly, I mean, it is a narrative, because it is putting forward one scenario, 2724 02:23:35,640 --> 02:23:38,880 and I'm putting attention to you, that there was a stalling in the contract. 2725 02:23:39,240 --> 02:23:42,820 This was the sweetener to make sure that this contract was signed, and it got it over the 2726 02:23:42,820 --> 02:23:43,080 deal. 2727 02:23:43,440 --> 02:23:47,660 I mean, you have said in your second statement, going back to the 23rd of June, when you apologised 2728 02:23:47,660 --> 02:23:48,100 and said... 2729 02:23:48,100 --> 02:23:51,980 It was a tasty little sweetener. 2730 02:23:51,980 --> 02:23:57,860 Did you believe that the money in terms of Renault was still coming from Renault and not to RTE? 2731 02:23:58,100 --> 02:23:59,700 What were you apologising for? 2732 02:24:00,560 --> 02:24:02,720 I was apologising for a different situation. 2733 02:24:02,720 --> 02:24:03,320 For figures that were printed in correctly. 2734 02:24:03,540 --> 02:24:05,640 Yeah, from the 2017, 18, 19. 2735 02:24:06,200 --> 02:24:06,460 Okay. 2736 02:24:06,700 --> 02:24:07,860 And we will have to conclude there. 2737 02:24:07,860 --> 02:24:08,040 Thank you for your time, Senator. 2738 02:24:08,040 --> 02:24:08,180 Thank you. 2739 02:24:08,180 --> 02:24:09,320 We will have to, Senator Ocasis. 2740 02:24:09,360 --> 02:24:09,920 Thank you very much. 2741 02:24:10,000 --> 02:24:10,460 Moving on. 2742 02:24:10,820 --> 02:24:12,280 Deputy Ciarán Cannon, the floor is yours. 2743 02:24:12,340 --> 02:24:12,980 And you have 10 minutes. 2744 02:24:13,680 --> 02:24:23,840 Mr Kelly, why did you agree to process a false invoice from RTE, which falsely describes the 2745 02:24:23,840 --> 02:24:30,000 services rendered, which to a company that you'd never heard of, and not to the company that 2746 02:24:30,000 --> 02:24:33,000 you were seeking to provide the services to, namely Renault. 2747 02:24:33,560 --> 02:24:40,240 Why did you process that invoice, you being, one would assume, a responsible director of a 2748 02:24:40,240 --> 02:24:46,900 longstanding company, and in doing so, in processing that false invoice, did you ever consider for a 2749 02:24:46,900 --> 02:24:54,640 moment the huge reputation of damage that might arise in such processing to a broadcaster that is 2750 02:24:54,640 --> 02:24:59,760 held in admiration and, I would argue, a degree of fondness by the Irish people? 2751 02:24:59,840 --> 02:25:05,600 Did you consider for a moment that if details of that false invoicing might emerge in the future, 2752 02:25:05,960 --> 02:25:08,560 what the reputation of damage might be to Ryan Tupperty? 2753 02:25:09,820 --> 02:25:14,560 Firstly, it wasn't a false invoicing. 2754 02:25:14,880 --> 02:25:15,840 It wasn't a false invoice. 2755 02:25:15,920 --> 02:25:16,560 What was, what was? 2756 02:25:16,840 --> 02:25:19,060 It was as parents instructed by RTE. 2757 02:25:19,220 --> 02:25:21,140 Okay, just stop, can we stop there? 2758 02:25:21,240 --> 02:25:23,780 You've been touting that line all day long. 2759 02:25:24,220 --> 02:25:28,500 I lost my dad a long, long time ago, but there's one line I will never forget. 2760 02:25:28,940 --> 02:25:33,080 When I would come home from school with an excuse, you know, if I'd been misbehaving and 2761 02:25:33,080 --> 02:25:37,640 Johnny next to me told me to do, you know, his question always was, if Johnny told you to 2762 02:25:37,640 --> 02:25:42,860 put your hand in the fire when you put it in, you cannot suggest for a moment a credible answer 2763 02:25:42,860 --> 02:25:45,260 to that question as RTE told me to do it. 2764 02:25:45,260 --> 02:25:51,220 It was a false invoice for services that were never provided to a company you supposedly had 2765 02:25:51,220 --> 02:25:51,860 never heard of. 2766 02:25:52,220 --> 02:25:57,060 Did you consider for a moment in processing that invoice the damage you were going to do to 2767 02:25:57,060 --> 02:25:58,640 Ryan Tupperty if it was ever found out? 2768 02:25:59,660 --> 02:26:01,240 Again, it wasn't a false invoice. 2769 02:26:02,000 --> 02:26:04,440 And we, and we invoiced Renault first of all. 2770 02:26:04,480 --> 02:26:06,280 Then under instruction, we invoiced the other company. 2771 02:26:06,540 --> 02:26:07,580 We assumed it was Renault paying. 2772 02:26:08,100 --> 02:26:09,060 We all know now. 2773 02:26:09,420 --> 02:26:10,020 We all know now. 2774 02:26:10,400 --> 02:26:10,860 No, no, no. 2775 02:26:11,000 --> 02:26:11,840 You knew then. 2776 02:26:11,840 --> 02:26:13,580 We always assumed that it was Renault paying. 2777 02:26:13,740 --> 02:26:15,380 But again, we were under instruction. 2778 02:26:15,880 --> 02:26:17,240 Renault drive to survive. 2779 02:26:17,240 --> 02:26:20,120 Did you see the invoice before it was issued from your company? 2780 02:26:20,780 --> 02:26:21,620 Did I see it? 2781 02:26:21,780 --> 02:26:22,000 Yes. 2782 02:26:22,400 --> 02:26:22,620 No. 2783 02:26:23,280 --> 02:26:23,940 You didn't see it? 2784 02:26:24,200 --> 02:26:24,540 Sorry. 2785 02:26:25,340 --> 02:26:31,880 The invoice that was issued by CMS to RTE for consultancy service, did you personally see 2786 02:26:31,880 --> 02:26:33,240 that invoice before it issued? 2787 02:26:33,380 --> 02:26:33,540 Yeah. 2788 02:26:33,800 --> 02:26:34,040 Sorry. 2789 02:26:34,200 --> 02:26:34,440 Yeah, no. 2790 02:26:34,700 --> 02:26:36,760 Brian, my, uh, Brian had sent it. 2791 02:26:37,580 --> 02:26:38,220 Who's Brian? 2792 02:26:38,560 --> 02:26:39,480 Brian is our accountant. 2793 02:26:39,680 --> 02:26:39,880 Okay. 2794 02:26:40,120 --> 02:26:41,140 And you didn't see the invoice? 2795 02:26:41,280 --> 02:26:42,760 No, I said Brian had sent it. 2796 02:26:43,400 --> 02:26:44,400 Okay, but did you see it? 2797 02:26:44,480 --> 02:26:44,600 Yeah. 2798 02:26:47,220 --> 02:26:47,760 I know. 2799 02:26:47,960 --> 02:26:48,440 Renault. 2800 02:26:48,720 --> 02:26:51,680 I, obviously I'm aware of it now, but I wouldn't have necessarily, 2801 02:26:51,680 --> 02:26:53,020 been aware of it at the time. 2802 02:26:54,160 --> 02:27:00,360 So you're saying that this invoice that issued to RTE on behalf of CMS for consultancy services, 2803 02:27:00,480 --> 02:27:03,600 you had no sight of that invoice before it issued to RTE? 2804 02:27:04,320 --> 02:27:07,240 Well, the instructions would have went to our accountant. 2805 02:27:08,500 --> 02:27:09,860 From the instructions from who? 2806 02:27:09,940 --> 02:27:10,500 From RTE. 2807 02:27:11,320 --> 02:27:11,600 Yes. 2808 02:27:11,700 --> 02:27:13,800 But again, I'm asking the question the third time. 2809 02:27:13,960 --> 02:27:19,560 The invoice that issued to RTE on behalf of CMS for consultancy services, did you personally see it? 2810 02:27:19,560 --> 02:27:21,100 I honestly can't remember. 2811 02:27:21,580 --> 02:27:22,280 You can't remember. 2812 02:27:22,280 --> 02:27:22,440 No. 2813 02:27:22,440 --> 02:27:23,480 I honestly can't remember. 2814 02:27:23,940 --> 02:27:24,180 Okay. 2815 02:27:24,720 --> 02:27:31,720 How many years has, has, has your company, um, Noel Kelly Management, uh, being issuing invoices to RTE? 2816 02:27:33,300 --> 02:27:38,740 For rent, for a services render from, from a, from a, all your, across all your, uh, roster of clients? 2817 02:27:38,740 --> 02:27:57,080 Well, CMS is our original company, which will be 26 years old. And then NK was formed in 2006 as a separate company just to, to work on, um, talent, books, all that sort of. So it was separated out as a separate company. 2818 02:27:57,080 --> 02:28:00,920 So CMS would have invoiced RTE in previous times for other services rendered? 2819 02:28:00,920 --> 02:28:01,240 Yes. 2820 02:28:02,760 --> 02:28:09,380 In the Grant Thornton report, the reporter, the person who has compiled that audit, says the following. 2821 02:28:09,960 --> 02:28:14,420 I met with the talents agent in relation to this review. Do you recall that meeting? 2822 02:28:14,680 --> 02:28:15,240 Yes, yes. 2823 02:28:16,340 --> 02:28:20,860 And he advised me that, referring to you, and I quote, 2824 02:28:21,020 --> 02:28:29,440 the talents agent understood from this that in a situation where the commercial brand relationship with RTE no longer existed, 2825 02:28:30,160 --> 02:28:33,780 or the commercial brand did not pay the 75,000 euro to the talent, 2826 02:28:34,280 --> 02:28:39,500 that RTE would be obliged to step in and pay the talent this sum. 2827 02:28:40,620 --> 02:28:45,140 Is that your recollection of the engagement and the discussion with the audience? 2828 02:28:47,300 --> 02:28:49,120 Sorry, where exactly is that on the report? 2829 02:28:49,740 --> 02:28:53,720 It's from the report that was submitted by Grant Thornton to the Auditor and Risk Committee RTE. 2830 02:28:53,720 --> 02:28:55,760 Where on the report is it? Sorry, I'm just trying to find it. 2831 02:28:55,820 --> 02:29:00,160 It's on... It's... 2.3. 2832 02:29:00,580 --> 02:29:01,380 2.3. 2833 02:29:02,680 --> 02:29:04,540 Paragraph G. I mean, it's a direct... 2834 02:29:04,540 --> 02:29:05,300 I'm reading... 2835 02:29:05,300 --> 02:29:08,340 He believed that these personal appearance events would endorse and embellish... 2836 02:29:08,340 --> 02:29:10,520 I'm reading directly from the audit of the report. 2837 02:29:10,740 --> 02:29:10,960 Sorry. 2838 02:29:11,140 --> 02:29:15,420 So, D, he believed that these personal appearance events would endorse and embellish 2839 02:29:15,420 --> 02:29:18,920 the commercial brand separate to their commercial brand's TV sponsorship. 2840 02:29:18,920 --> 02:29:19,980 Yeah. 2841 02:29:21,260 --> 02:29:22,340 But do you see point G? 2842 02:29:22,740 --> 02:29:23,180 Oh, sorry. 2843 02:29:23,300 --> 02:29:24,120 I just touched that point D. 2844 02:29:24,220 --> 02:29:24,840 Excuse me. Sorry. 2845 02:29:24,940 --> 02:29:27,840 The talent's agent understood from this in a situation where the commercial brand relationship 2846 02:29:27,840 --> 02:29:31,520 with RTE would no longer exist, or the commercial brand wouldn't pay the 75,000 euro, 2847 02:29:31,520 --> 02:29:36,500 that RTE would be obliged to step in and pay the talent this sum. 2848 02:29:36,900 --> 02:29:39,540 But at any time, we never expected RTE to pay this. 2849 02:29:39,820 --> 02:29:40,040 Ever. 2850 02:29:40,120 --> 02:29:40,420 Ever. 2851 02:29:40,420 --> 02:29:41,860 But you required that RTE would. 2852 02:29:42,000 --> 02:29:42,600 No, we... 2853 02:29:42,600 --> 02:29:44,620 Not with Chairman's Toy Machine. 2854 02:29:44,620 --> 02:29:44,720 Sorry. 2855 02:29:44,720 --> 02:29:48,340 And again, the relationship with RTE is with the sponsor. 2856 02:29:48,340 --> 02:29:48,820 Drive to survive. 2857 02:29:48,820 --> 02:29:49,480 Pure and simple. 2858 02:29:49,480 --> 02:29:49,720 To survive. 2859 02:29:49,720 --> 02:29:51,600 And they manage it so closely. 2860 02:29:51,840 --> 02:29:52,840 And of course they do. 2861 02:29:52,900 --> 02:29:57,100 And want to mind it because it brings in a lot of money over that period. 2862 02:29:58,420 --> 02:29:58,900 Sorry. 2863 02:29:59,460 --> 02:29:59,940 So... 2864 02:29:59,940 --> 02:30:02,780 The bottom line is, Mr. Kelly... 2865 02:30:02,780 --> 02:30:03,180 Sorry. 2866 02:30:03,180 --> 02:30:03,280 Sorry. 2867 02:30:03,280 --> 02:30:03,500 Sorry. 2868 02:30:03,500 --> 02:30:03,800 Sorry. 2869 02:30:03,800 --> 02:30:04,400 That you... 2870 02:30:04,400 --> 02:30:04,760 And... 2871 02:30:04,760 --> 02:30:06,720 You were acting in your client's interests. 2872 02:30:07,440 --> 02:30:13,060 But in order to ensure that this 75,000 euro payment would be made for the whole period of the five-year term... 2873 02:30:13,060 --> 02:30:13,460 Yeah. By Renault. 2874 02:30:13,800 --> 02:30:14,120 That... 2875 02:30:14,120 --> 02:30:14,340 No. 2876 02:30:14,540 --> 02:30:15,580 That is not by Renault. 2877 02:30:15,800 --> 02:30:17,520 You've explicitly asked... 2878 02:30:17,520 --> 02:30:17,660 No. 2879 02:30:18,000 --> 02:30:18,240 Sorry. 2880 02:30:18,360 --> 02:30:18,500 Sorry. 2881 02:30:18,580 --> 02:30:18,740 Sorry. 2882 02:30:18,740 --> 02:30:19,300 That was my point. 2883 02:30:19,380 --> 02:30:19,540 Sorry. 2884 02:30:19,620 --> 02:30:19,780 Sorry. 2885 02:30:19,780 --> 02:30:20,200 Excuse me. 2886 02:30:20,260 --> 02:30:21,020 I'm just getting tired. 2887 02:30:23,740 --> 02:30:24,920 Renault racing shoes. 2888 02:30:25,140 --> 02:30:26,340 The agreement was made. 2889 02:30:27,020 --> 02:30:29,380 As far as I was concerned, it wasn't for RTE to pay. 2890 02:30:29,560 --> 02:30:30,480 Never was for RTE to pay. 2891 02:30:30,600 --> 02:30:33,000 Obviously, the sponsor of the show. 2892 02:30:33,120 --> 02:30:34,100 Because it's extra activities. 2893 02:30:34,420 --> 02:30:35,440 It's a separate contract. 2894 02:30:35,760 --> 02:30:36,400 It shows that... 2895 02:30:36,400 --> 02:30:37,140 It shows that... 2896 02:30:37,140 --> 02:30:39,080 That are still owed. 2897 02:30:40,080 --> 02:30:41,200 Like... 2898 02:30:41,200 --> 02:30:44,660 We never expected that RTE were going to be paying that. 2899 02:30:45,720 --> 02:30:46,540 But yet... 2900 02:30:46,540 --> 02:30:48,400 Why did you require it to be written... 2901 02:30:48,400 --> 02:30:49,540 Why then did you require... 2902 02:30:49,540 --> 02:30:49,540 Sorry. 2903 02:30:49,660 --> 02:30:49,860 Sorry. 2904 02:30:49,960 --> 02:30:50,480 And I'll tell you why. 2905 02:30:50,740 --> 02:30:51,260 In case... 2906 02:30:51,260 --> 02:30:52,520 So, say a new sponsor come in. 2907 02:30:52,620 --> 02:30:54,740 And I don't want to name a brand in case it's... 2908 02:30:54,740 --> 02:30:55,840 So, it's... 2909 02:30:55,840 --> 02:30:56,020 Okay. 2910 02:30:56,260 --> 02:30:57,580 It's fluffy, fluffy, fluffy. 2911 02:30:57,720 --> 02:30:58,440 Can I just stop here? 2912 02:30:58,460 --> 02:31:00,920 You've been mentioning the new sponsor opportunity all day long. 2913 02:31:00,920 --> 02:31:01,080 No. 2914 02:31:01,280 --> 02:31:01,480 I'm not... 2915 02:31:01,480 --> 02:31:02,360 I'm saying it's just... 2916 02:31:02,360 --> 02:31:03,100 Just call it fluffy pillows. 2917 02:31:03,100 --> 02:31:04,060 Whatever, maybe. 2918 02:31:04,320 --> 02:31:05,000 So, once there... 2919 02:31:05,000 --> 02:31:06,520 Yeah, but we're in the middle of a pandemic... 2920 02:31:06,520 --> 02:31:08,240 So, fluffy pillows... 2921 02:31:08,240 --> 02:31:08,980 One voice. 2922 02:31:09,080 --> 02:31:09,620 One voice. 2923 02:31:09,740 --> 02:31:10,800 Featuring red out. 2924 02:31:10,960 --> 02:31:11,320 Et cetera. 2925 02:31:11,440 --> 02:31:17,220 We're not exactly queuing up in the middle of a pandemic to fork out 75,000 euro per annum 2926 02:31:17,220 --> 02:31:18,640 for whatever services might be rendered. 2927 02:31:18,640 --> 02:31:19,140 But, deputies... 2928 02:31:19,140 --> 02:31:20,140 So, the bottom line is... 2929 02:31:20,140 --> 02:31:24,940 So, the bottom line is, you were aware that entering into a really difficult period for the country 2930 02:31:24,940 --> 02:31:30,240 and for business financially, that there was a possibility that any sponsor, no sponsor, 2931 02:31:30,240 --> 02:31:32,560 might exist for the remaining years of the contract. 2932 02:31:32,560 --> 02:31:32,740 Sure. 2933 02:31:33,100 --> 02:31:47,060 And then you asked RTE to ensure that it would underwrite in the event that there was nobody coming on stream, in terms of sponsorship, RTE and the taxpayer and the license payer would be left on the hoop for that 75,000 euro. 2934 02:31:47,060 --> 02:31:59,060 So, in relation to all of that, all we ever wanted to know that if there was another sponsor on board, that we would be informed. 2935 02:31:59,560 --> 02:32:09,120 We asked to be informed in relation to pay increases, pay top ten, and that didn't happen either. 2936 02:32:09,780 --> 02:32:16,960 This is a commercial agreement, a special commercial, a separate commercial agreement with Renault. 2937 02:32:16,960 --> 02:32:20,380 Always to be paid by Renault. We never, ever understood that anyone's who would claim it. 2938 02:32:21,440 --> 02:32:29,540 In those six years, as I've said, from 17 to 22, Brian Trubody's shows brought in 100 million euros. 2939 02:32:29,760 --> 02:32:31,020 That's 100 million euros, right? 2940 02:32:31,180 --> 02:32:36,600 Now, you can say, well, you know, I could bring in 100 million, and maybe you could, you know? 2941 02:32:36,840 --> 02:32:39,680 But at the end of the day, this is a commercial agreement. 2942 02:32:40,100 --> 02:32:41,500 Renault wanted to do the events. 2943 02:32:42,120 --> 02:32:46,780 From RTE's perspective, it was great to embellish and to extend the sponsorship. 2944 02:32:47,400 --> 02:32:48,720 Renault.ie. 2945 02:32:48,720 --> 02:32:50,740 And destruction from RTE, Deputy. 2946 02:32:51,520 --> 02:32:51,820 Okay. 2947 02:32:52,640 --> 02:32:58,200 But why did you insist that RTE would put in an underwriting aspect of the contract? 2948 02:32:58,200 --> 02:32:59,520 In case the sponsor changed. 2949 02:33:00,400 --> 02:33:02,980 Okay, but what if the sponsor left? Well, there were no sponsors. 2950 02:33:02,980 --> 02:33:04,140 If there were no sponsors, then RTE was... 2951 02:33:04,140 --> 02:33:07,400 If there were no sponsors, then you wouldn't be doing events. 2952 02:33:08,480 --> 02:33:10,960 You know, that was to embellish the sponsorship. 2953 02:33:11,460 --> 02:33:12,900 If there was no sponsor, there'd be... 2954 02:33:12,900 --> 02:33:16,740 And as Ryan said, there was literally, there should have been nine done at this stage. 2955 02:33:16,980 --> 02:33:17,760 There was three done. 2956 02:33:18,060 --> 02:33:18,680 There's six owed. 2957 02:33:18,740 --> 02:33:21,180 If they're not called on, that won't be given back. 2958 02:33:21,400 --> 02:33:23,020 So, like, it can't be any clearer than that. 2959 02:33:24,360 --> 02:33:31,460 But in the agreement that you had with RTE, in the account you gave to the auditors, you said the following. 2960 02:33:31,920 --> 02:33:39,060 You said that if the commercial brand did not pay the 75,000 euro to the talent, no mention of any services being rendered... 2961 02:33:39,060 --> 02:33:43,100 ...or an additional service being provided that RTE would be in general. 2962 02:33:43,320 --> 02:33:44,100 We have a dialogue. 2963 02:33:44,280 --> 02:33:46,280 A wider conversation needs to be had. 2964 02:33:46,380 --> 02:33:51,720 As a similar conversation, the honest account of the act of account of the original account of the original account is that... 2965 02:33:51,720 --> 02:33:52,440 ...assumption made. 2966 02:33:52,440 --> 02:33:55,280 ...to include those who may not need to be considered. 2967 02:33:55,280 --> 02:33:57,120 You're not looking at everyone in the context. 2968 02:33:57,400 --> 02:33:58,160 You're taking context. 2969 02:33:58,160 --> 02:33:58,660 You're not taking context. 2970 02:33:58,660 --> 02:33:59,160 You're not taking context. 2971 02:33:59,160 --> 02:34:01,400 And if there was no sponsor, I'm not in the event. 2972 02:34:01,400 --> 02:34:02,640 No, because you're an idiot. 2973 02:34:02,640 --> 02:34:03,240 You're an idiot. 2974 02:34:03,240 --> 02:34:03,900 You're not in the event. 2975 02:34:03,900 --> 02:34:04,440 You're an idiot. 2976 02:34:04,440 --> 02:34:05,440 You're an idiot. 2977 02:34:05,440 --> 02:34:05,440 You're an idiot. 2978 02:34:05,440 --> 02:34:06,440 You're an idiot. 2979 02:34:06,440 --> 02:34:07,440 You're an idiot. 2980 02:34:07,440 --> 02:34:08,440 You're an idiot. 2981 02:34:08,440 --> 02:34:09,440 You're an idiot. 2982 02:34:09,440 --> 02:34:10,440 You're an idiot. 2983 02:34:10,440 --> 02:34:11,440 Especially the idiots. 2984 02:34:11,440 --> 02:34:12,440 You can't say that. 2985 02:34:12,440 --> 02:34:13,440 What I'm saying is... 2986 02:34:13,440 --> 02:34:14,440 But you requested it. 2987 02:34:14,440 --> 02:34:15,440 You actually specifically requested it. 2988 02:34:15,440 --> 02:34:19,440 No, I asked them to underwrite the sponsor agreement so we could actually talk to the sponsor. 2989 02:34:19,440 --> 02:34:29,440 I'm going to finish on this because three weeks, six hours of questioning today, and I appreciate both of you coming in here to try and restore... 2990 02:34:29,440 --> 02:34:30,440 Thank you. 2991 02:34:30,440 --> 02:34:33,440 ...and I think it's exceptionally important that we should collectively try and restore the reputation. 2992 02:34:33,440 --> 02:34:34,440 Completely. 2993 02:34:34,440 --> 02:34:39,440 ...of our national broadcaster and one of its most gifted broadcasters. 2994 02:34:39,440 --> 02:34:40,440 Right? 2995 02:34:40,440 --> 02:34:43,440 Six hours later, in my opinion, we're no further on. 2996 02:34:43,440 --> 02:34:48,440 And I genuinely mean that with a heart and a half in terms of what we're trying to set out to do here. 2997 02:34:48,440 --> 02:35:04,440 There was a whole issue of the arrangement that was put in place with RTE, the deliberate falsifying of an invoice to channel money deceitfully from RTE through ASTRS back to total. 2998 02:35:04,440 --> 02:35:05,440 Sure. 2999 02:35:05,440 --> 02:35:08,440 All of that, those questions are now left hanging in the air. 3000 02:35:08,440 --> 02:35:12,440 And six hours later, we're no further on in restoring the reputation. 3001 02:35:12,440 --> 02:35:13,440 Sure. 3002 02:35:13,440 --> 02:35:14,440 Deputy, Deputy. 3003 02:35:14,440 --> 02:35:15,440 Deputy, I hear you 100%. 3004 02:35:15,440 --> 02:35:18,440 That's a question for RTE. 3005 02:35:18,440 --> 02:35:20,440 Brands ambassadors. 3006 02:35:20,440 --> 02:35:21,440 It is. 3007 02:35:21,440 --> 02:35:23,440 We have answered everything that we know. 3008 02:35:23,440 --> 02:35:24,440 Dr. 3009 02:35:24,440 --> 02:35:25,440 Keira Kelke. 3010 02:35:25,440 --> 02:35:26,440 Thank you, Deputy. 3011 02:35:26,440 --> 02:35:27,440 Thank you, Deputy. 3012 02:35:27,440 --> 02:35:28,440 Thank you, Deputy. 3013 02:35:28,440 --> 02:35:29,440 Thanks for your look. 3014 02:35:29,440 --> 02:35:32,440 And good afternoon to the witnesses again. 3015 02:35:32,440 --> 02:35:33,440 Thanks for staying with us. 3016 02:35:33,440 --> 02:35:42,440 I just want to start off with the tripartite agreement between Renault Ireland Limited, RTE and Ryan Tuberty. 3017 02:35:43,440 --> 02:35:50,440 Can I ask, Mr. Kelly, were you involved in the negotiations around the content of this agreement? 3018 02:35:50,440 --> 02:35:52,440 The disagreement was put together by RTE. 3019 02:35:52,440 --> 02:35:55,440 Were you involved in the negotiations for it? 3020 02:35:55,440 --> 02:35:57,440 No, it was put together by RTE. 3021 02:35:57,440 --> 02:36:00,440 No matter what they wanted, where it would happen, how it would happen, exactly. 3022 02:36:00,440 --> 02:36:04,440 Okay, so there's very specific detail in here in terms of dates. 3023 02:36:04,440 --> 02:36:09,440 We know those dates because of COVID weren't done or subsequently they were. 3024 02:36:09,440 --> 02:36:14,440 So those dates were put in without any consultation with yourself? 3025 02:36:14,440 --> 02:36:15,440 No, that's right. 3026 02:36:15,440 --> 02:36:20,440 Dates in so far as obviously that the dealership, that it suited the dealership, that Ryan was free. 3027 02:36:20,440 --> 02:36:21,440 I reckon the President. 3028 02:36:21,440 --> 02:36:25,440 So it's obviously the overall... 3029 02:36:25,440 --> 02:36:27,440 Yeah, it's all the logistics of it. 3030 02:36:27,440 --> 02:36:28,440 Okay. 3031 02:36:28,440 --> 02:36:31,440 And hence why there was a requirement for the signature on the back. 3032 02:36:31,440 --> 02:36:35,440 And we know that signature wasn't for coming until April of this year. 3033 02:36:35,440 --> 02:36:38,440 No, but the contract is from RTE. 3034 02:36:38,440 --> 02:36:39,440 Okay. 3035 02:36:39,440 --> 02:36:42,440 So this contract was for one year. 3036 02:36:42,440 --> 02:36:46,440 It was dated October 2020 to the 31st of December 2021. 3037 02:36:46,440 --> 02:36:48,440 Am I right in saying that? 3038 02:36:48,440 --> 02:36:50,440 It's on the front of it here. 3039 02:36:50,440 --> 02:36:53,440 So this tripartite agreement? 3040 02:36:53,440 --> 02:36:56,440 Yeah, the contract's for five years. 3041 02:36:56,440 --> 02:36:58,440 Well, I'm talking specifically about this contractor. 3042 02:36:58,440 --> 02:37:00,440 Oh sure, that's for year one. 3043 02:37:00,440 --> 02:37:02,440 This is for year one. 3044 02:37:02,440 --> 02:37:17,440 So at the end of year one of this, was there renewed communication, renewed negotiations with regard the continuation of year two, three, four, five? 3045 02:37:17,440 --> 02:37:18,440 Sure, sure. 3046 02:37:18,440 --> 02:37:23,440 So two, three, four, five would have just been other venues, other events. 3047 02:37:23,440 --> 02:37:28,440 Again, I'll just discuss with what Rena wanted with RTE and how that would happen. 3048 02:37:28,440 --> 02:37:34,440 So there's no comprehensive negotiation with a view of extending this particular one year contract? 3049 02:37:34,440 --> 02:37:36,440 It's a five year contract. 3050 02:37:36,440 --> 02:37:40,440 Sorry, I'm talking specifically about this, the tripartite agreement? 3051 02:37:40,440 --> 02:37:43,440 Yeah, sorry. 3052 02:37:43,440 --> 02:37:45,440 The RT pres... 3053 02:37:45,440 --> 02:37:47,440 Tripartite with Renault. 3054 02:37:47,440 --> 02:37:48,440 Contract. 3055 02:37:48,440 --> 02:37:49,440 Feel the apartheid. 3056 02:37:49,440 --> 02:37:51,440 Ryan's contract is a five year contract. 3057 02:37:51,440 --> 02:37:52,440 Yes, five year contract. 3058 02:37:52,440 --> 02:37:57,440 But it doesn't, it does not, in Ryan's five year contract, it does not mention any reference to Renault. 3059 02:37:57,440 --> 02:37:58,440 No, no, no. 3060 02:37:58,440 --> 02:38:02,440 It does not mention any reference to his engagements or anything like that. 3061 02:38:02,440 --> 02:38:03,440 Ryan's contract. 3062 02:38:03,440 --> 02:38:13,440 I'm talking specifically about the legal contract which was entered by you for Mr. Tuberty. 3063 02:38:13,440 --> 02:38:17,440 Was there any renegotiation of this after year one? 3064 02:38:17,440 --> 02:38:18,440 No, this was year one. 3065 02:38:18,440 --> 02:38:27,440 No, this was year one of a five year agreement where each year the... 3066 02:38:27,440 --> 02:38:30,440 That's not contained anywhere in this. 3067 02:38:30,440 --> 02:38:31,440 That was year one. 3068 02:38:31,440 --> 02:38:32,440 Okay. 3069 02:38:32,440 --> 02:38:39,440 There's no mention anywhere of any commercial agreement or anything like that contained in this five year contract, is there? 3070 02:38:39,440 --> 02:38:41,440 But the invoice was to Renault? 3071 02:38:41,440 --> 02:38:42,440 No, no. 3072 02:38:42,440 --> 02:38:45,440 I'm asking the five year contract that you refer to... 3073 02:38:45,440 --> 02:38:46,440 Renault! 3074 02:38:46,440 --> 02:38:53,440 Can you point out specifically where there is mention of a commercial arrangement, a commercial agreement in that five year contract? 3075 02:38:53,440 --> 02:38:55,440 Again, the commercial agreement is actually... 3076 02:38:55,440 --> 02:38:58,440 I think you're missing the point. 3077 02:38:58,440 --> 02:38:59,440 We'll move on. 3078 02:38:59,440 --> 02:39:04,440 Sorry, sorry, sorry, they're separate agreements. 3079 02:39:04,440 --> 02:39:11,440 I know they're separate agreements, but you're saying this one year agreement was contained within a five year agreement. 3080 02:39:11,440 --> 02:39:16,440 I'm asking, can you point out specifically where there is mention of a commercial element? 3081 02:39:16,440 --> 02:39:17,440 They're separate. 3082 02:39:17,440 --> 02:39:18,440 They're separate. 3083 02:39:18,440 --> 02:39:19,440 Okay. 3084 02:39:19,440 --> 02:39:20,440 We'll move on. 3085 02:39:20,440 --> 02:39:25,440 Just in relation to the six outstanding gigs that you make reference to. 3086 02:39:25,440 --> 02:39:26,440 Sure. 3087 02:39:26,440 --> 02:39:37,440 RTE feel there, when questioned about the two payments of $75,000, that they were legally obliged to make those payments. 3088 02:39:37,440 --> 02:39:44,440 You're saying that the six gigs that you make reference to, that element, haven't been honoured at this stage. 3089 02:39:44,440 --> 02:39:48,440 So, are RTE wrong in saying that they were legally obliged to make those two payments? 3090 02:39:48,440 --> 02:39:49,440 So... 3091 02:39:49,440 --> 02:39:52,440 If the contract was not fully adhered to? 3092 02:39:52,440 --> 02:39:56,440 So, the six events again, 2021... 3093 02:39:56,440 --> 02:39:57,440 Drive to survive! 3094 02:39:57,440 --> 02:40:03,440 The first three happened 22, the next three 23 this year, and the next 24. 3095 02:40:03,440 --> 02:40:07,440 So, we've established after year one, Renault was no longer paying. 3096 02:40:07,440 --> 02:40:10,440 So, they're out of the picture. 3097 02:40:10,440 --> 02:40:22,440 It was RTE through some mechanism that was contrived to hide the payments, were ultimately going to $275,000 payments. 3098 02:40:22,440 --> 02:40:28,440 So, where is the legal obligation on RTE to pay those $275,000 payments? 3099 02:40:28,440 --> 02:40:33,440 If you're saying that the six gigs that haven't been honoured... 3100 02:40:33,440 --> 02:40:34,440 Sure. 3101 02:40:34,440 --> 02:40:37,440 ... cannot be honoured because there is no contract there with Renault now. 3102 02:40:37,440 --> 02:40:44,440 So, on that basis, will those two payments, the $150,000, be repaid towards the year? 3103 02:40:44,440 --> 02:40:46,440 Oh, if you may, do you mind if I come in? 3104 02:40:46,440 --> 02:40:50,440 Without question, I've said this before today and I'd like to clarify it again. 3105 02:40:50,440 --> 02:40:56,440 I have six jobs or gigs, whatever word you wish to do, to use, outstanding. 3106 02:40:57,440 --> 02:41:01,440 And they were paid for, as I say, as you rightly say, in advance. 3107 02:41:01,440 --> 02:41:08,440 The point being, if those gigs are not called upon, if my services aren't called upon, the money goes straight back. 3108 02:41:09,440 --> 02:41:13,440 Okay, so Renault are no more part of the equation, so you cannot do gigs for... 3109 02:41:13,440 --> 02:41:15,440 No, no, no, no, they're outstanding. 3110 02:41:15,440 --> 02:41:18,440 So, for example, if Renault turned around and said, "Actually, we want you to go round..." 3111 02:41:18,440 --> 02:41:21,440 Can we move on? Just in relation to... 3112 02:41:21,440 --> 02:41:27,440 You said, Mr. Kelly, that you didn't really have, you know, a personal relationship with the Director-General. 3113 02:41:27,440 --> 02:41:33,440 Can I ask, in relation to your relationship with the Director of Commercial, Geraldine O'Leary, 3114 02:41:33,440 --> 02:41:37,440 what kind of a relationship would you say you had with Geraldine O'Leary? 3115 02:41:37,440 --> 02:41:42,440 Again, I would have met Geraldine maybe once or twice a year. 3116 02:41:42,440 --> 02:41:47,440 Not actually met her, probably bumped into her, but I wouldn't have a relationship. 3117 02:41:47,440 --> 02:41:51,440 You know, that's commercial. This is the only commercial thing there that we've done. 3118 02:41:51,440 --> 02:41:54,440 So I would be dealing more with the Managing Director of TV... 3119 02:41:54,440 --> 02:41:56,440 Excuse me, sorry. 3120 02:41:56,440 --> 02:41:59,440 So we have no real relationship with Geraldine O'Leary? No, no, no. 3121 02:41:59,440 --> 02:42:10,440 And a lot has come to light in relation to the barter accounts, the misuse of the barter accounts, the slush fund, the trips abroad, everything else that went with it. 3122 02:42:10,440 --> 02:42:21,440 Can I ask you, Mr. Kelly, did you avail of any of those things, trips abroad, golf events, wining, dining, anything like that from RTE? 3123 02:42:21,440 --> 02:42:28,440 I've... To be honest with you, I... I don't go out. I don't do a whole lot. 3124 02:42:28,440 --> 02:42:31,440 Yes or no, yes or no. Did you avail of any of those? 3125 02:42:31,440 --> 02:42:35,440 RTE, I've never been entertained by RTE, and it's not something that I'm interested in. 3126 02:42:35,440 --> 02:42:37,440 In relation to the barter accounts. 3127 02:42:37,440 --> 02:42:39,440 I've never been entertained by RTE, I think he's just said. 3128 02:42:39,440 --> 02:42:42,440 The time we didn't know who asked us was, and we presumed that... 3129 02:42:42,440 --> 02:42:44,440 Okay, okay. No, I asked the new person... 3130 02:42:44,440 --> 02:42:49,440 Sorry, Mr. Kelly. Sorry, Mr. Kelly. I have no friendship or relationship with Geraldine O'Leary. 3131 02:42:49,440 --> 02:42:55,440 You didn't receive any benefit from RTE in terms of any of those trips abroad or... 3132 02:42:55,440 --> 02:42:56,440 No. 3133 02:42:56,440 --> 02:42:58,440 ...wining, dining, golf outings or anything like that? 3134 02:42:58,440 --> 02:42:59,440 Did any of your staff members... 3135 02:42:59,440 --> 02:43:01,440 I have no idea of any of that. I have no idea of any of that. 3136 02:43:01,440 --> 02:43:03,440 Okay. Would any of your staff members? 3137 02:43:03,440 --> 02:43:05,440 No. Sure. No, not at all. 3138 02:43:05,440 --> 02:43:11,440 Okay. And in terms of gifts from your company to anyone on RTE, is that something that you would do? 3139 02:43:11,440 --> 02:43:13,440 No. No. Christmas cards. 3140 02:43:13,440 --> 02:43:15,440 Christmas cards. Okay. 3141 02:43:15,440 --> 02:43:16,440 Christmas cards, huh? 3142 02:43:16,440 --> 02:43:20,440 Just in relation to the issuing of default invoices... 3143 02:43:20,440 --> 02:43:21,440 Christmas cards. 3144 02:43:21,440 --> 02:43:33,440 Mr. Kelly, again, you will be acutely aware of the responsibilities for company directors, ensuring that their actions are legal, ethical and in the best interest of the company. 3145 02:43:33,440 --> 02:43:40,440 You know, the due diligence that must be applied. So there's a knownness and a responsibility on you. 3146 02:43:40,440 --> 02:43:47,440 Now you have stated from the outset here and you've held a line that you're acting under the instruction of RTE. 3147 02:43:47,440 --> 02:43:58,440 That, you know, and on that basis, those invoices were issued. Ignorance is no defence in law, Mr. Kelly. 3148 02:43:58,440 --> 02:44:02,440 So do you still stand over that you are doing your job appropriately? 3149 02:44:02,440 --> 02:44:03,440 Sure. 3150 02:44:03,440 --> 02:44:16,440 You are doing your job in not providing any due diligence and no legal oversight. And you still stand over that those invoices were correct and you've done your job appropriately. 3151 02:44:16,440 --> 02:44:21,440 As per page 25, we're acting under instructions for RTE. 3152 02:44:21,440 --> 02:44:30,440 But ignorance is no defence, Mr. Kelly. In hindsight, I'm asking you, do you think you've done your job in issuing those invoices? 3153 02:44:30,440 --> 02:44:36,440 Not whether, whose, whose instructions you were acting under. In hindsight. 3154 02:44:36,440 --> 02:44:41,440 Sure. Sure Debbie, I think hindsight's an incredible thing. But we are here today. 3155 02:44:41,440 --> 02:44:49,440 I know that. And I try to get an answer. And at any time, we're doing it with total transparency and that's what we do. 3156 02:44:49,440 --> 02:44:58,440 Okay. That's what we do. And as I said, we came here today, but within this email that came to me. 3157 02:44:58,440 --> 02:45:04,440 If you send it back to me, I'll sort everything else out. These are RTE instructions. 3158 02:45:04,440 --> 02:45:05,440 Okay. And honestly, I mean like... 3159 02:45:05,440 --> 02:45:13,440 So I'm asking you, I'm asking you in hindsight, the issuing of those two invoices for consultancy fees that we know have been established. 3160 02:45:13,440 --> 02:45:23,440 No consultancy was provided by yourself or Mr. Tuberty. Do you stand over that those invoices were issued correctly and in accordance with the law? 3161 02:45:23,440 --> 02:45:30,440 Those were issued correctly and in accordance with our T's instructions and they're legal. 3162 02:45:30,440 --> 02:45:45,440 Just final question through the chair. I just want to establish a clear timeline in terms of the engagement with the light and who knew what when. I tried to establish that earlier on. 3163 02:45:45,440 --> 02:45:55,440 And Mr. Tuberty, you said earlier on that you found out about the light review. And what date did you say? 3164 02:45:55,440 --> 02:46:00,440 This is the report. The report, yeah. Grant Thornton. Grant Thornton, sorry. Grant Thornton. 3165 02:46:00,440 --> 02:46:07,440 I think sometime around May is from my recollection. It was May or June. I don't know the detail of that. 3166 02:46:07,440 --> 02:46:14,440 I think you said June earlier on, the 22nd of June or something like that. That's good enough for me, yeah. 3167 02:46:15,440 --> 02:46:22,440 Mr. Kelly again. When did you first engage with Grant Thornton? 3168 02:46:22,440 --> 02:46:32,440 So on the 3rd of May, RT Legal emailed us. RT Legal. 3169 02:46:32,440 --> 02:46:40,360 invoice queries 26th of may wrote to us 26th of may would be doing an investigation 31st of may 3170 02:46:43,000 --> 02:46:48,600 and then the 23rd of june which would have been your first time which was when ortee at least 3171 02:46:51,320 --> 02:46:57,000 okay so the day after they made the first statement that's um a whole month in the difference 3172 02:46:57,000 --> 02:47:05,240 between you first finding out um engaging with grant thornton um and mr tuberty first becoming aware 3173 02:47:05,240 --> 02:47:11,000 so there was no engagement between yourself mr kelly and mr troberty in that intervening 3174 02:47:11,000 --> 02:47:19,720 it seems a bit strange a bit bizarre you know would not generate some communication between the two 3175 02:47:19,720 --> 02:47:26,280 years given the seriousness of uh the the charge uh the seriousness of of of the issue so you're 3176 02:47:26,280 --> 02:47:31,320 saying that it was the the third of may and mr company yeah that's right if i if i can answer 3177 02:47:31,320 --> 02:47:36,600 that if i can if i can answer that um you've said the seriousness of the charge 3178 02:47:39,000 --> 02:47:47,480 is the question um in relation to that we willingly met with grant thornton and i i'm sorry i'm sorry 3179 02:47:47,480 --> 02:47:52,520 i'm sorry i'm talking about the month the month difference between you engaging with grant 3180 02:47:52,520 --> 02:47:57,800 and mr public finding out here no no no and the lack of communication that's not something we would i 3181 02:47:57,800 --> 02:48:02,760 know what that sounds probably sounds odd but you wouldn't be talking to me about that stuff on until i 3182 02:48:02,760 --> 02:48:07,720 find that strange i know i appreciate the seriousness of the issue that there would not be no communication 3183 02:48:07,720 --> 02:48:13,080 there and the personal implications i find that very strange i appreciate that i'm now calling on 3184 02:48:13,080 --> 02:48:17,800 senator maria sherlock the floor is yours thank you very much chair and thank you very much to mr 3185 02:48:17,800 --> 02:48:22,200 tobert d and to mr kelly for appearing here today i think we've got a situation where there's a lot of 3186 02:48:22,200 --> 02:48:27,320 people out there very sorely disappointed that we have a a much-loved broadcaster you know embroiled in 3187 02:48:27,320 --> 02:48:34,520 such controversy and now we have the national broadcaster um in broad you know in in a deadly 3188 02:48:34,520 --> 02:48:41,320 series situation so thank you for the paperwork that you you've given to us today um i want to ask a 3189 02:48:41,320 --> 02:48:47,080 series of questions about the the pay cuts and mr tobert you just have to say that the what you've said 3190 02:48:47,080 --> 02:48:55,320 in your statement about the the depiction of the 20 percent cost it does not stack up um uh and and that 3191 02:48:55,320 --> 02:49:01,880 you depict the renault contract as being entirely separate like that the late late show set was to 3192 02:49:01,880 --> 02:49:11,080 be used for these renault um uh gigs does not reflect that this is a separate arrangement in fact you 3193 02:49:11,080 --> 02:49:18,360 were using the rte brand um for this commercial arrangement uh and similarly as well we're not 3194 02:49:18,360 --> 02:49:23,640 comparing comparing like with like because of the reduction in hours because of the increase in the 3195 02:49:23,640 --> 02:49:30,680 pre-records between the 2015 to 2020 contract in the 2020 to 2025 contract so i think that's just 3196 02:49:30,680 --> 02:49:36,760 important certainly in my interpretation of of looking at it but mr kelly i just want to add in your um 3197 02:49:37,400 --> 02:49:45,640 your letters the correspondence back and forth you talk about a 41 reduction over the past five years no 3198 02:49:46,200 --> 02:49:52,760 no well actually sorry just just to say you actually say oh over the last five years and you wrote the 3199 02:49:52,760 --> 02:49:59,320 emails in 2020 so we have to take it it's in the period 2015 to 2020 i can quote you back exactly what 3200 02:49:59,320 --> 02:50:07,240 you said 20 percent no no you said okay i'm gonna have to find it but you said 41 of the last five years so 3201 02:50:07,240 --> 02:50:16,680 um we we we uh this represents a 41 reduction over the past five years and this is an email dated in february 3202 02:50:16,680 --> 02:50:27,800 2020. so when i look at the figures of what you set out in 2017 2018 and 2019 and we expect that what ryan was 3203 02:50:27,800 --> 02:50:34,760 paid was what was published was actually what he was paid in in 2015 and 2016 it's on around two and a 3204 02:50:34,760 --> 02:50:42,520 half million right so if he was to be taking a 41 reduction between the 2015 to 2020 con period relative 3205 02:50:42,520 --> 02:50:48,280 to the 2020 to 2025 period we're looking at some sort of a pay of four over four and a half million or close 3206 02:50:48,280 --> 02:50:54,840 to four and a half million can you explain are there additional payments in 2015 and 2016 that you haven't set out 3207 02:50:54,840 --> 02:51:01,560 here are there additional payments that were on top of the published payments for 2015 and 2016 that would 3208 02:51:01,560 --> 02:51:09,320 add up to the 41 reduction that you talk about in the correspondence sure thank you um the the years 3209 02:51:09,320 --> 02:51:17,880 that are in question are from injury time to 20. but that is okay well sorry just to say just and i just need 3210 02:51:17,880 --> 02:51:23,960 to read you back this represents a 41 reduction over the past five years and you said that in 2020. sure 3211 02:51:23,960 --> 02:51:29,160 i don't think i'm going to get an answer no no i'm trying to give you the answer yeah that was from 3212 02:51:29,160 --> 02:51:41,080 2012 um at a height of 720 000 to 440 000. sorry just your your your own words here do not relate to 2012. 3213 02:51:41,080 --> 02:51:45,720 they relate to the past five years and you wrote this email in 2020. so i've asked you if there were 3214 02:51:45,720 --> 02:51:51,240 additional payments for the years that you have not given us details for today 2015 and 2016. perhaps you may 3215 02:51:51,240 --> 02:51:55,640 wish to come back and furnish the committee but certainly you you've written this a number of 3216 02:51:55,640 --> 02:52:01,000 times in the correspondence sure and it's very clear it's 2015 to 2020 is the period that you're 3217 02:52:01,000 --> 02:52:06,600 talking about no the period i'm talking about is from 2012 to 2020. okay what you wrote so it was factually 3218 02:52:06,600 --> 02:52:12,440 incorrect in in in the correspondence it had to have been you talked about five years sorry where can you 3219 02:52:12,440 --> 02:52:19,160 tell me tell me where that is yeah page 10 page 10. yeah anyway i think you will need to go back and 3220 02:52:19,160 --> 02:52:25,000 review because you do not really refer to 2012 you say the past five years and that email was written in 3221 02:52:25,000 --> 02:52:33,400 2020. i want to ask you about the reno deal because i'm conscious that time is pressing on um we have two documents here 3222 02:52:34,120 --> 02:52:45,880 we have the contract for fees of 440 000 for 20 20 20 20 25. we have a one-year deal between reno and ryan 3223 02:52:45,880 --> 02:52:54,520 tuberty there are no fees uh addressed in this document are there separate is there a separate document 3224 02:52:54,520 --> 02:53:03,160 detailing the fees associated with this work that's a separate contract again i've asked you is there a 3225 02:53:03,160 --> 02:53:07,720 separate document setting out the fees associated with this one-year contract 3226 02:53:11,080 --> 02:53:16,280 yeah um or just sorry that or she drafted that document but the fees are recorded in the emails 3227 02:53:18,040 --> 02:53:24,520 but we don't have the emails to show the final agreement we only have the emails leading up to 3228 02:53:24,520 --> 02:53:33,240 the agreement and and you say that this is a five-year agreement so where is the agreement for the final 3229 02:53:33,240 --> 02:53:42,040 four years because we only have year one here the in the the page 12 the february february emails all 3230 02:53:42,040 --> 02:53:54,040 confirm 75 000. but i don't believe that that is the final is that are you saying that on the 28th of 3231 02:53:54,040 --> 02:54:02,520 february you concluded negotiations between rt and yourselves for the entirety of the the package 3232 02:54:02,520 --> 02:54:08,600 ryan tuberty's package my understanding is that it was july it was when it was concluded it was late in 3233 02:54:08,600 --> 02:54:17,240 that but this was this is where where it was outlined so so basically we just have one or two lines with 3234 02:54:17,240 --> 02:54:24,920 a with an agreement of 75 000 per year every year for five years but there's no detail as to the services 3235 02:54:24,920 --> 02:54:32,360 that would be provided after year one we only have year one's detail of service and i also have page 22 3236 02:54:33,560 --> 02:54:42,360 the email uh invoice request july 2020 and so can again this is this is the relationship between 3237 02:54:42,360 --> 02:54:48,120 orti and reno nothing to do with us can i can imagine please send an invoice for 75 000 to reno ireland 3238 02:54:48,120 --> 02:54:55,240 for the attention of redacted wording as follows sorry what page are you on page 22 page 22 22 deputies 3239 02:54:56,520 --> 02:55:03,160 the page i'm looking at is the final page of the contract 3240 02:55:03,160 --> 02:55:17,560 so so redacted you're saying the email is all that we have with regards to the contract sorry sorry it's page 23 3241 02:55:17,560 --> 02:55:24,680 apologies apologies right right no stress look brian is stressed as fuck so you're saying that all we 3242 02:55:24,680 --> 02:55:33,160 have for the con for the contract between reno and ryan tuberty for the final four years is just based on an invoice 3243 02:55:33,880 --> 02:55:45,640 it's not based on an invoice it's based on orte orte and reno no but sir but but i don't see a contract i just see an email and i just see an invoice there's a piece missing in the middle and it's 3244 02:55:46,200 --> 02:55:51,640 partnership between reno ireland uh bespoke cardish to include personal appearance activity program to be 3245 02:55:51,640 --> 02:56:02,840 agreed between reno ireland or t and nk okay so so where is that that's like page 23 oh no i i i i 3246 02:56:02,840 --> 02:56:09,480 appreciate that but where is the bespoke partnership document for the four years like you've chased up 3247 02:56:09,480 --> 02:56:14,760 so so we we understand that there was a a transfer a payment made for the first year 3248 02:56:14,760 --> 02:56:22,840 from reno right and then there was you you chased up uh two subsequent payments yes for which services 3249 02:56:22,840 --> 02:56:27,640 were not provided services are outstanding no no no i appreciate that sure but you were chasing you know 3250 02:56:27,640 --> 02:56:33,480 payments for services that were not provided services that are outstanding okay so where is the documentation 3251 02:56:33,480 --> 02:56:43,880 detailing the those services to be provided we've never seen that documentation i don't know what sorry uh so 3252 02:56:43,880 --> 02:56:49,480 what documentation well the bespoke partnership like isn't what why would you have a detailed contract 3253 02:56:49,480 --> 02:56:55,560 for year one and not for the following years anyway i just want to i think there's there's a series of 3254 02:56:55,560 --> 02:57:02,840 questions that need to be all our that was because i i want to try and explain everything um the contract was 3255 02:57:02,840 --> 02:57:09,800 rolled over from 20 to 22 obviously with covid so each year there will be different requirements it's time to 3256 02:57:09,800 --> 02:57:15,400 electrify different different events different setups so you know each one that was different events 3257 02:57:15,400 --> 02:57:23,400 different setups so everything was bespoke to when when it worked for you when it when everybody could 3258 02:57:23,400 --> 02:57:28,760 actually do it but we've no paperwork to the services but anyway i need to move on i have three questions 3259 02:57:28,760 --> 02:57:46,360 questions and fairness i need to ask mr chopper do you okay um uh uh right you had a phrase in your your your your your your your your um in the middle of the pandemic i think if i can quote it correctly it was mind yourself mind each other and 3260 02:57:46,360 --> 02:57:54,440 uh upon the conclusion of this package for you in 2020 about seven months later there were pay cuts back 3261 02:57:54,440 --> 02:58:00,840 on the table for rt staff now obviously you're only one you know you're one person is part of a team for 3262 02:58:00,840 --> 02:58:07,240 both your radio program and your television program how did you feel about those pay cuts knowing that you had a guarantee 3263 02:58:07,800 --> 02:58:14,280 for five year period that you would be not asked for any pay cuts well i i believe that i had taken cuts 3264 02:58:14,280 --> 02:58:23,160 and that i was part of the pay cut process so you know i i i see you're trying to quite my 3265 02:58:24,280 --> 02:58:30,840 response to covid and my feeling you seem to be a little bit but because it's just that i would hate that 3266 02:58:31,480 --> 02:58:36,520 it really upsets me to know to think that people would think that i was that i didn't mean that that came from 3267 02:58:36,520 --> 02:58:41,000 a very very important part of my heart you know it really did and you know the being being the no 3268 02:58:41,000 --> 02:58:46,680 just please while i'm here you know the toy show for example and the toy show being presenting that show 3269 02:58:46,680 --> 02:58:52,360 that that's a very that that's part of my essence do you know what i mean and i suppose so all this 3270 02:58:52,360 --> 02:58:57,560 talking and sorry mr just to say but what's what's what's be fair mr i will give you a chance but just 3271 02:58:57,560 --> 02:59:01,320 let the member finish your line of questions of course i apologize because i'm strong because like a 3272 02:59:01,320 --> 02:59:09,880 researcher on your television show yes it takes takes them 12 years to earn 53 945 yeah i know and 3273 02:59:09,880 --> 02:59:15,800 they're extremely good at their job and and so we have on one side a guarantee of no caution and yes then 3274 02:59:15,800 --> 02:59:21,000 people earning that little amount of money that very modest income were going through pay cuts so yeah i 3275 02:59:21,000 --> 02:59:26,440 suppose i'm just asking how you felt i felt that i was operating under the belief that i was undergoing pay 3276 02:59:26,440 --> 02:59:31,400 cuts too so you know obviously totally like outrageously different level i get that but i 3277 02:59:31,400 --> 02:59:35,160 do a different job and everyone brings different things to the table but i understand what you're 3278 02:59:35,160 --> 02:59:39,960 saying okay i mean just reminded debbie or senator you've run out of time completely but if you have one 3279 02:59:39,960 --> 02:59:44,360 last mile of 30 seconds two two very final questions right because i think these are important 3280 02:59:45,080 --> 02:59:50,520 i suppose you you've said a number of times today um mr toberty that you know your job is in front of 3281 02:59:50,520 --> 02:59:57,320 the mic your job is with words not with the accounts and you leave the process to others but as a contractor you 3282 02:59:57,320 --> 03:00:05,400 are a company director every year you have to sign off on a legal document yes as a company director you and 3283 03:00:05,400 --> 03:00:12,200 another director yes and you have to verify you have to to sign off that you have uh you know that 3284 03:00:12,200 --> 03:00:16,520 you've taken responsibility that i paid my taxes well no no no no no actually it's much more detailed than 3285 03:00:16,520 --> 03:00:22,040 that that that you've actually signed off on the veracity of the accounts so when it when you're signing off 3286 03:00:22,040 --> 03:00:28,280 would you not take an interest on how some of those payments originated well i have to say i i i always 3287 03:00:28,840 --> 03:00:36,600 trust my agent who trusts the process who uh who gets the the deal done if you like so yeah i i just 3288 03:00:37,080 --> 03:00:43,640 i believe in it i trust but i think the thing is to conclude yeah and i suppose the last question is 3289 03:00:45,480 --> 03:00:48,920 you know throughout your time as a broadcaster you've had to interview 3290 03:00:49,640 --> 03:00:55,560 p-sheik you know politicians people from all walks of life right and i suppose integral to being a 3291 03:00:55,560 --> 03:01:00,200 broadcaster is integrity yes and i want to ask you now because you make very clear you want to get 3292 03:01:00,200 --> 03:01:06,280 back on air yes i do and i think there's lots of people who want to see you back on air but is your 3293 03:01:06,280 --> 03:01:11,240 integrity damaged do you think given what you've admitted earlier you should have put up your hand 3294 03:01:11,960 --> 03:01:17,560 and you have these payments which i don't think any of us are happy with in terms of you know that 3295 03:01:17,560 --> 03:01:22,440 ultimately were for your benefit but you know they were anonymized your name wasn't on it do you think 3296 03:01:22,440 --> 03:01:27,640 your integrity is damaged i don't think i'm a different person to the one who in the last six 3297 03:01:27,640 --> 03:01:33,720 months or 14 years promoted vince and de paul or no i'm not told children not to bully each other 3298 03:01:35,800 --> 03:01:39,800 no this is my answer to your question or promote child literacy and do all these really important 3299 03:01:39,800 --> 03:01:46,920 things that i think matter not just to me but to you know my fellow citizens like literally kids 3300 03:01:46,920 --> 03:01:52,600 reading all these important things and and and yes this this salary is enormous i understand that 3301 03:01:52,600 --> 03:02:00,120 but that doesn't affect my soul it can't okay we are going to conclude on that senator to our witnesses 3302 03:02:00,120 --> 03:02:04,920 can i just explain to you where we're at okay because i know you're exhausted we're near the end of the day 3303 03:02:04,920 --> 03:02:10,120 we are at the three hour point now because we're a little bit late starting a little bit late back 3304 03:02:10,120 --> 03:02:15,080 from the break you'll be happy to know i'm the last person to have any sort of latitude to ask questions 3305 03:02:15,080 --> 03:02:19,880 i was going to keep my questions not at 10 i was going to keep my questions at four minutes if that's okay 3306 03:02:19,880 --> 03:02:25,080 with you there are three members here who have sat through all of the deliberations over the last couple 3307 03:02:25,080 --> 03:02:31,080 of days with your permission i'd like to give them two minutes each and those being senator timmy dooley 3308 03:02:31,080 --> 03:02:36,840 deputy richard by barrett and senator eugene mark eugene murphy uh they have been here for all but 3309 03:02:36,840 --> 03:02:41,560 would you be agreeable to sitting through another 10 minutes beyond the the time allocated there's 3310 03:02:41,560 --> 03:02:45,320 there's no question i just think two minutes probably isn't a whole heap of time for people i work 3311 03:02:45,320 --> 03:02:50,200 well i used to work in radio i know what two minutes feels like so i i understand and look we're you 3312 03:02:50,200 --> 03:02:55,240 know in for a penny like i mean we're let's let's do what you need to do for a process respect what 3313 03:02:55,240 --> 03:03:00,920 you're doing here so by only if you're not no but but please we're here now so ask your questions and 3314 03:03:00,920 --> 03:03:06,120 i wouldn't say the two minutes like please take take your time but we do understand this we're now into 3315 03:03:06,120 --> 03:03:10,120 our six or seven hours as you can see mr toby they're getting latitude so don't worry about that okay 3316 03:03:10,680 --> 03:03:16,520 uh so i my own slides next if that's okay of course can i just begin as i said i'm not going to take 3317 03:03:16,520 --> 03:03:21,320 10 minutes i'm going to cut to the chase and say that everything definitely kieran cannon has said 3318 03:03:21,320 --> 03:03:26,360 today would be where i would come from and i concur with all of the points he's made here today he 3319 03:03:26,360 --> 03:03:31,000 represents everything and reflects everything that's going on in my head so with the four minutes i have 3320 03:03:31,000 --> 03:03:36,600 i have a couple of questions to you mr kelly first can i ask you how many personalities let's say we're 3321 03:03:37,080 --> 03:03:42,840 refraining from calling people top ten personalities will say in rte do you represent that work in rte currently 3322 03:03:42,840 --> 03:03:49,480 maybe you may not know that top of your head seven in total seven and but only three that would have 3323 03:03:50,040 --> 03:03:57,640 a contract for tv and radio the rest would just have you know sort of small contracts okay can i ask 3324 03:03:57,640 --> 03:04:05,560 you you have been opinions today to remind my colleagues in the public that you have worked with rte over the last 23 years am i right 3325 03:04:05,560 --> 03:04:11,960 three years yeah 23 years in those 23 years representing various personalities have you ever been instructed 3326 03:04:12,680 --> 03:04:19,640 instructed as you said today by rte to raise invoices that didn't accurately reflect the service you were 3327 03:04:19,640 --> 03:04:24,760 providing or that your personalities were providing in those 23 years was this the first and only time 3328 03:04:24,760 --> 03:04:30,040 you can recall that you're ever at and can i ask you why you went along with it and why you didn't disagree 3329 03:04:30,040 --> 03:04:34,440 with that because we've been working with them for 23 years like i trusted the process 3330 03:04:37,560 --> 03:04:43,960 to you mr toby two quick questions you said if i'm right that uh you have worked with rt or been around 3331 03:04:43,960 --> 03:04:51,160 the corridors of rt since you were 12 in 1986 very good yeah can i ask you were you ever employed directly 3332 03:04:51,160 --> 03:05:00,280 by rt yes i would have been for for a while when i was uh uh probably about 26 or seven for a few years 3333 03:05:00,280 --> 03:05:07,160 and then it became apparent that my career was going in a different direction to maybe i had realized i didn't 3334 03:05:07,160 --> 03:05:11,880 know and then at that stage you know somebody who i trust said to me look you're going to be moving 3335 03:05:11,880 --> 03:05:16,360 into a different level now and with that you should have somebody minding your business because you're 3336 03:05:16,360 --> 03:05:21,720 you're completely incompetent at this okay and they were correct well can i ask you at what point in 3337 03:05:21,720 --> 03:05:28,040 your career was that you were advised by somebody in rte to not be a direct employee to go solo as you 3338 03:05:28,040 --> 03:05:32,520 said yourself and get yourself an external contractor i couldn't give you the exact year not to be evasive 3339 03:05:33,000 --> 03:05:39,400 just a simple matter of of memory but um probably around the time of tuberty tonight which then plus 3340 03:05:39,400 --> 03:05:45,080 14 plus five so about 20 years ago thereabouts and can i ask you more sorry maybe 25. who in rte gave 3341 03:05:45,080 --> 03:05:48,680 you that advice i have no idea i couldn't tell you for a minute it's not that i'm trying to protect 3342 03:05:48,680 --> 03:05:53,240 them which is just 25 years ago but that concludes my questions i'm trying to keep actually it was a 3343 03:05:53,240 --> 03:05:58,760 fellow presenter at the time no one's reminding me here it was jerry ryan actually not um not a member of 3344 03:05:58,760 --> 03:06:03,320 um staff if you like okay that's going to conclude my questions because as i said i concur with 3345 03:06:03,320 --> 03:06:08,520 everything deputy kieran cannon has said and i'm going to move on really quickly uh our non-members if 3346 03:06:08,520 --> 03:06:12,040 you can just be respectful of the fact that our colleagues are staying on or our witness are staying 3347 03:06:12,040 --> 03:06:16,360 on so to keep to your three minutes if that's okay uh senator timiduley thank you very much chair and 3348 03:06:16,360 --> 03:06:22,680 just to thank the witness to recognize that they're here of their own free will um from my perspective um 3349 03:06:23,560 --> 03:06:30,920 i'm here to try to hold rte to account i welcome you as witnesses um not here to hold you to account 3350 03:06:30,920 --> 03:06:37,240 um you're separate to the to to to to what this committee um is trying to do and the big issue for 3351 03:06:37,240 --> 03:06:45,880 us from rt's perspective over recent weeks has been the view expressed by the chair of the board eventually 3352 03:06:45,880 --> 03:06:53,480 of rte that there was an effort to conceal the payments to mr tubby which you've identified and 3353 03:06:53,480 --> 03:06:57,880 it's in the grand thorns report that you had no hand act apart in that i think people accept that 3354 03:06:57,880 --> 03:07:03,880 generally but there's an issue within rte management within rte in the very early stages seem to suggest 3355 03:07:03,880 --> 03:07:10,840 that only one person knew the entirety of that the Taoiseach various government ministers have said that's not 3356 03:07:10,840 --> 03:07:16,440 credible no i don't think it's credible i'd like to know what you think mr kelly having been involved 3357 03:07:16,440 --> 03:07:22,120 in the negotiations in the discussion sure um do you think d forbes is the only person that you not at all 3358 03:07:22,680 --> 03:07:28,440 um not at all and could you identify faro's recognizing the privilege but if i if i could 3359 03:07:28,440 --> 03:07:33,560 just say to you that any meeting that i ever had with with miss forbes and it was six or seven and i can't 3360 03:07:33,560 --> 03:07:41,560 even remember it that was about it was always with her with her her her um chief financial officers or or 3361 03:07:41,560 --> 03:07:46,520 or their people or her legal team or other parts of the legal team as well she was never on her own 3362 03:07:46,520 --> 03:07:51,880 she was never on her own she couldn't um like there's nobody nobody can make that decision no director 3363 03:07:51,880 --> 03:07:57,320 general um no chair did have to it have to be discussed by by too many people so so that's the 3364 03:07:57,320 --> 03:08:03,880 bizarreness that one person could actually okay i'm sorry to be rushing because i don't want to i 3365 03:08:03,880 --> 03:08:10,120 don't want to upset our chair um miss o'keefe last week talked about you know and you've heard it from 3366 03:08:10,120 --> 03:08:15,080 others that things were stalled and that they had to try to get a deal you were doing the best you can 3367 03:08:15,080 --> 03:08:21,160 for your client that's totally understandable and that this notion of a commercial deal was added in 3368 03:08:23,160 --> 03:08:28,360 i don't want to be critical to be respectful to everyone i think it stretches a little bit to 3369 03:08:28,360 --> 03:08:32,920 suggest that the two are separate because in all the emails it appears that the commercial 3370 03:08:33,560 --> 03:08:38,600 this commercial deal with with reynolds is stitched into the emails it doesn't make its way 3371 03:08:38,600 --> 03:08:43,480 into the contract but it's stitched in in the in the chronology of the emails so 3372 03:08:44,680 --> 03:08:50,520 part of the remuneration you didn't think it was going to be paid by rt i accept that and i accept but but 3373 03:08:50,520 --> 03:08:56,840 but ryan has said that he didn't expect rt to be paying for that's fine but the head the the miss o'keefe 3374 03:08:56,840 --> 03:09:03,400 indicated that when things stalled the head of content started to discuss and negotiate with you can 3375 03:09:03,400 --> 03:09:09,720 you talk to us a little bit about how what what transpired in those discussions so that was with you 3376 03:09:09,720 --> 03:09:35,480 i get it i get it i get it but traditionally we would just on this issue with the wizard but but but this is this is the back to the issue so we would meet with the md of radio the md of tv and collectively they would say we want municipal sequester units 3377 03:09:38,600 --> 03:09:44,200 15 year sequester with no right to reply and all meals without salt 3378 03:09:44,200 --> 03:09:52,280 the new renault sequester 15 day junket around the promenade of dreams 3379 03:09:56,920 --> 03:09:59,800 crazy to think in two years time we're going to be sequestered 3380 03:10:03,800 --> 03:10:11,080 i returned to work after the five weeks sequester i felt refreshed in my usual self 3381 03:10:14,920 --> 03:10:20,600 i think there's one thing that these globalists really need to know and then once they do know they'll fear and that's 3382 03:10:21,320 --> 03:10:35,800 but once we cage them up into a lock box we'll throw away the key and we'll weld another cage around that cage as well because these cunts need to realize that they're getting sequestered 3383 03:10:44,920 --> 03:10:54,520 value out of the sponsorship and keep the sponsor on for for for for the period of of the five years and i get that but i i i it it it it stretches things with everything we've heard 3384 03:10:54,520 --> 03:10:55,260 everything we've heard. 3385 03:10:55,420 --> 03:10:55,780 Senator? 3386 03:10:56,100 --> 03:10:58,320 But it goes back then to the point that I think Ciarán Cannon raised, 3387 03:10:58,420 --> 03:11:00,580 which was that point G in the Grant Thornton report, 3388 03:11:00,680 --> 03:11:01,620 that makes it very clear. 3389 03:11:01,760 --> 03:11:03,280 And you've used a word throughout the day, 3390 03:11:03,300 --> 03:11:05,080 and I've listened intently to what you've said. 3391 03:11:05,420 --> 03:11:07,940 You've talked about underwriting and you've explained that. 3392 03:11:08,680 --> 03:11:10,660 But in all the emails that you make to RTE, 3393 03:11:10,900 --> 03:11:13,600 and I think if I was looking for an agent, 3394 03:11:13,740 --> 03:11:15,540 I'd be looking for someone like you on my side. 3395 03:11:16,620 --> 03:11:18,980 I'd be looking for the fellow who has the top seven that I don't have. 3396 03:11:19,080 --> 03:11:21,540 You'd be looking for somebody that could generate more money than I might. 3397 03:11:21,660 --> 03:11:21,840 But anyway. 3398 03:11:22,700 --> 03:11:25,000 You also stitch in the word guarantee. 3399 03:11:26,540 --> 03:11:30,180 So you talk about underwriting and guaranteeing. 3400 03:11:30,440 --> 03:11:33,420 And when you go into the Grant Thornton report at item G, 3401 03:11:33,880 --> 03:11:36,820 it also talks about that your understanding was that, 3402 03:11:37,200 --> 03:11:40,360 and I'll have to paraphrase, but somebody can quote it later, 3403 03:11:40,900 --> 03:11:44,160 that in the event of the sponsor going away, 3404 03:11:45,220 --> 03:11:47,480 if the sponsor going away are moving to some... 3405 03:11:47,480 --> 03:11:50,360 I'll just get it because I have it here, Chairman, and I'll be very brief. 3406 03:11:50,360 --> 03:11:51,460 So it says, 3407 03:11:51,880 --> 03:12:17,460 The talent also understood that RTE, okay, understood that this is a situation where the commercial brand, okay, the talent agent understood from this, that in a situation where the commercial brand relationship with RTE no longer existed, or the commercial brand did not pay the 75,000 to the talent, that RTE would be obliged to step in and pay the talent this sum. 3408 03:12:17,460 --> 03:12:31,880 Now, I have to read that as it is. It's hard to see why that would be the case if RTE were the one that came up with this idea. Do you know what I'm saying? Isn't it kind of hard to figure that? 3409 03:12:31,880 --> 03:12:45,440 Again, the relationship with the sponsors is with RTE. And what I was trying to protect was that if the sponsor changed, and the sponsor's still there, the sponsor's still there, and this is year, it's 2021-22, this is four years later. 3410 03:12:45,860 --> 03:12:55,660 So if the sponsor changed, that we will be able to literally have a conversation with the sponsor in relation to what they would need, because we haven't got that relationship. 3411 03:12:55,660 --> 03:12:59,260 We don't have that relationship. That's an RTA and sponsored relationship. 3412 03:12:59,260 --> 03:12:59,420 I know. 3413 03:12:59,640 --> 03:13:01,240 I'm really going to have to stop. 3414 03:13:01,240 --> 03:13:01,540 Thank you. 3415 03:13:02,240 --> 03:13:02,580 Thank you. 3416 03:13:03,260 --> 03:13:04,980 Richard Boye-Barrett had three minutes. 3417 03:13:05,400 --> 03:13:08,980 Okay, thanks. And look, this has been intense for everybody. 3418 03:13:09,160 --> 03:13:12,160 So I understand seven hours of this is difficult. 3419 03:13:12,300 --> 03:13:18,000 But what we do, our job is to recognise that people who are the biggest victims are the TV licence payer. 3420 03:13:18,000 --> 03:13:23,440 And indeed the other RT staff who have been affected by this. 3421 03:13:24,000 --> 03:13:27,540 And who are required to take substantial pay cuts. 3422 03:13:28,240 --> 03:13:29,620 It's our job to ask these questions. 3423 03:13:30,180 --> 03:13:31,620 We've been waiting. 3424 03:13:32,440 --> 03:13:42,720 At the heart of this, it seems to me, is that publicly it was stated that everybody, including Ryan, were taking pay cuts at the time. 3425 03:13:44,300 --> 03:13:51,040 And then we have discovered that there were these payments being made, right, which were kept secret. 3426 03:13:52,340 --> 03:13:56,820 Which RT executives have acknowledged was an organised deception. 3427 03:13:58,020 --> 03:14:05,380 And that they were mislabeled as consultancy fees, these payments, by somebody. 3428 03:14:06,020 --> 03:14:08,300 Right now, Noel has said, well, it was nothing to do with us. 3429 03:14:08,380 --> 03:14:13,000 That was under RT instructions, which is a little bit difficult to credit. 3430 03:14:13,260 --> 03:14:18,780 But the other bit of your narrative, and this is the bit I want to just concentrate on. 3431 03:14:18,840 --> 03:14:31,340 It's following on from what Timmy said, is that the commercial arrangement and the pay reduction that was publicly stated as having happened were somehow two separate things. 3432 03:14:32,780 --> 03:14:34,940 Now, can I just put it to you honestly? 3433 03:14:34,940 --> 03:14:47,280 Honestly, that doesn't look credible from the emails that are exchanged between Noel Kelly and the RT during that early period in 2020. 3434 03:14:48,000 --> 03:15:00,520 Because the first mention, the first mention in the emails, now I haven't seen all the correspondence, but the first mention of the 75,000 from a commercial relationship is put forward by you now. 3435 03:15:00,840 --> 03:15:02,720 That's the first mention that I see. 3436 03:15:03,300 --> 03:15:11,220 It also says, in that very first email on January the 16th, terms and conditions of this underwritten and guaranteed by RTE. 3437 03:15:11,320 --> 03:15:21,860 It goes on to say that the fees above would include the 120,000 owed to Ryan, and it also suggests there should be four less shows and a reduction in radio shows. 3438 03:15:21,960 --> 03:15:37,100 In other words, the negotiating position that you were adopting on behalf of Ryan was linked to the overall pay cut, but then seemed to be insisting on things that would effectually mean that the pay cut wouldn't happen in real terms. 3439 03:15:38,360 --> 03:15:42,900 Isn't that a reasonable reading of what we're seeing here? 3440 03:15:43,160 --> 03:15:51,840 And that in the negotiation then, basically there's a pushback from RTE over a lot of the conditions that you seem to be insisting on. 3441 03:15:52,520 --> 03:16:05,900 And if I might just put this other bit, it also refers on the 19th of February to you saying as part of this negotiating process that we had a meeting with our clients, which is Ryan, in the process of these negotiations. 3442 03:16:06,900 --> 03:16:16,180 So that you were discussing the details, or at least according to your email to RTE, you were discussing the details of this back and forward of negotiations. 3443 03:16:16,620 --> 03:16:19,120 So this is in the emails that you've provided us. 3444 03:16:19,520 --> 03:16:21,420 Now, I haven't even had a chance to read them all. 3445 03:16:22,080 --> 03:16:23,900 But that, on the face, that's what it looks like. 3446 03:16:24,900 --> 03:16:34,500 From here, and I'm trying to be genuinely objective, and I hear what you're saying, but that looks like you are pushing for everything to mitigate against the pay cut. 3447 03:16:35,700 --> 03:16:36,860 Do you want to cut it? 3448 03:16:37,360 --> 03:16:38,140 Is it okay? 3449 03:16:38,460 --> 03:16:50,280 So, page five of the relevant documents is from, again, the chief legal officer, sorry, the CFO. 3450 03:16:51,140 --> 03:16:55,380 And point four, commercial sponsor with third party facilitated by RTE. 3451 03:16:56,080 --> 03:17:03,440 It wasn't started, or it wasn't, we didn't go looking for that or start, that was completely facilitated by them. 3452 03:17:03,980 --> 03:17:10,980 In relation to contract, of course, if I could just answer, in relation to contract, there's always, there's always back and forth. 3453 03:17:11,140 --> 03:17:19,180 RTE's job is to give, and BBC and ITV, is to give as little as possible to get the greatest return, to get the greatest commercial return. 3454 03:17:19,260 --> 03:17:22,540 And it's all based on advertising and commercial revenue. 3455 03:17:22,740 --> 03:17:24,760 But no, no, I have to honestly say this. 3456 03:17:24,840 --> 03:17:35,560 The first mention in the email back and forth of a commercial arrangement is in your correspondence, where you set down the conditions of accepting the overall pay reduction. 3457 03:17:35,700 --> 03:17:44,100 And then, in fact, it's clear from the responses from RTE that they only subsequently identified who that commercial entity might be. 3458 03:17:44,420 --> 03:17:54,920 I was, I, so, that email, that you referenced, Deputy, was in response to point four, commercial sponsorship with third party facilitated by RTE. 3459 03:17:55,480 --> 03:17:56,800 Page five, point four. 3460 03:17:56,940 --> 03:17:59,540 So, I was responding to that. 3461 03:17:59,980 --> 03:18:01,780 So, I had no emails originated. 3462 03:18:02,000 --> 03:18:05,240 All along, it was an RTE and a Renault sponsorship. 3463 03:18:05,620 --> 03:18:07,460 And they guarded jealously. 3464 03:18:07,780 --> 03:18:08,800 You know, and of course you would. 3465 03:18:08,800 --> 03:18:13,880 And commercial, in commercial organisations, they mind their advertisers, they mind the sponsors. 3466 03:18:14,120 --> 03:18:16,840 And that's what you have to do to make sure that they come back again. 3467 03:18:16,920 --> 03:18:17,560 So, that's all that that was. 3468 03:18:17,560 --> 03:18:18,300 No, I'll be honest. 3469 03:18:18,560 --> 03:18:22,080 From looking at this, it doesn't look that way. 3470 03:18:22,300 --> 03:18:22,480 Right. 3471 03:18:22,560 --> 03:18:23,480 I've just been honest with you. 3472 03:18:24,020 --> 03:18:25,360 Very last, just... 3473 03:18:25,360 --> 03:18:26,440 Absolutely. 3474 03:18:27,320 --> 03:18:32,080 On the tripartite agreement that... 3475 03:18:32,080 --> 03:18:32,680 Excuse me, sorry. 3476 03:18:33,240 --> 03:18:45,440 ...for October 2020-21, could you just explain why it wasn't signed by, I think it's Niamh McCormack, on behalf of Ryan Tuberty, until the 21st of the 4th, 2023. 3477 03:18:45,440 --> 03:18:46,040 Because... 3478 03:18:46,640 --> 03:18:49,180 And last question, because I won't get another chance. 3479 03:18:49,960 --> 03:18:53,700 Ryan, do you think, on reflection... 3480 03:18:53,700 --> 03:18:53,920 Yep. 3481 03:18:54,260 --> 03:18:55,700 Right, when you look at what's happened... 3482 03:18:55,700 --> 03:18:55,900 Yes. 3483 03:18:55,980 --> 03:18:57,780 ...the public feeling about this... 3484 03:18:57,780 --> 03:18:57,940 Yes. 3485 03:18:58,960 --> 03:19:07,560 Do you think people would be justified in saying that the huge sort of gap between the pay that top presenters such as yourself get... 3486 03:19:07,560 --> 03:19:07,740 Yes. 3487 03:19:07,780 --> 03:19:11,240 ...and what the production team at the back, which is a fraction of that... 3488 03:19:11,240 --> 03:19:11,480 Yes. 3489 03:19:11,900 --> 03:19:16,820 ...should be something that people fairly would look at and question the gap between those. 3490 03:19:16,820 --> 03:19:17,520 Mean, yes, hooverous stuff. Thank you very much. 3491 03:19:17,520 --> 03:19:18,580 I would agree with... 3492 03:19:18,580 --> 03:19:20,540 Mr. Toby, can I just ask you to pause for a second... 3493 03:19:20,540 --> 03:19:23,400 Hello, Frances. Do you have any plans for regular streams? 3494 03:19:23,800 --> 03:19:24,620 And she's very conscious... 3495 03:19:24,620 --> 03:19:26,060 Look, I want to get back streaming. 3496 03:19:26,340 --> 03:19:27,640 So, just before you respond... 3497 03:19:27,640 --> 03:19:28,580 I want to get back streaming. 3498 03:19:28,600 --> 03:19:34,020 ...would you mind if I just ask Senator Murphy if he had a quick question or comment that he could come in with that, and then you could respond over to everybody. 3499 03:19:34,020 --> 03:19:35,840 As a group, I'm not trying to avoid your question, obviously. 3500 03:19:35,840 --> 03:19:36,960 Yeah, yeah, no, you're fine. 3501 03:19:37,020 --> 03:19:37,280 Thank you. 3502 03:19:37,440 --> 03:19:38,720 Senator Murphy, yeah? 3503 03:19:38,860 --> 03:19:41,320 You've done this as well, because you've managed to get everybody in. 3504 03:19:41,380 --> 03:19:45,780 I really appreciate Ryan and Noel that you've come here in your own capacity. 3505 03:19:46,020 --> 03:19:50,840 You offer to come here, and you've had six grueling hours. There's no doubt about that. 3506 03:19:50,840 --> 03:19:54,800 And I also know this takes a toll on families, because we as politicians know... 3507 03:19:54,800 --> 03:19:55,660 Glad you mentioned that. 3508 03:19:55,660 --> 03:19:56,800 ...when something happens... 3509 03:19:56,800 --> 03:19:57,560 Thank you for saying that. 3510 03:19:57,560 --> 03:19:59,780 ...ourselves, we see how our families are affected. 3511 03:19:59,800 --> 03:20:00,900 There's a lot of collateral damage. 3512 03:20:00,920 --> 03:20:03,360 And I brought this up again. It happens to politicians all the time. 3513 03:20:03,520 --> 03:20:03,700 True. 3514 03:20:03,780 --> 03:20:06,180 And unfortunately, we have a social media element... 3515 03:20:06,180 --> 03:20:06,460 Yeah. 3516 03:20:06,900 --> 03:20:10,780 ...which have, on numerous occasions, have had total disrespect for people. 3517 03:20:10,780 --> 03:20:15,800 You know something? I hope that I can come back here in another capacity to talk to a committee about mental health and online media. 3518 03:20:15,920 --> 03:20:16,740 So, at least... 3519 03:20:16,740 --> 03:20:17,900 And traditional media. 3520 03:20:18,180 --> 03:20:18,680 So, at least... 3521 03:20:18,680 --> 03:20:19,640 But, yeah, that's another day's work. 3522 03:20:19,820 --> 03:20:24,420 We live in a country where you people present yourself to come here, and we can question you. 3523 03:20:24,480 --> 03:20:25,020 And look... 3524 03:20:25,020 --> 03:20:26,040 That's democracy in action. 3525 03:20:26,300 --> 03:20:26,520 Yes. 3526 03:20:26,600 --> 03:20:28,460 Have you questions, Senator Murphy? Questions? 3527 03:20:28,460 --> 03:20:29,600 Very quick questions. Very quick questions. 3528 03:20:30,040 --> 03:20:31,840 One, do you accept that this... 3529 03:20:31,840 --> 03:20:33,740 Mr Kelly, also, thank you for coming. 3530 03:20:33,740 --> 03:20:37,420 Do you accept that this looks a bit of a three-carat trick to the public? 3531 03:20:38,200 --> 03:20:41,500 Number two, do you accept that it looks to be a shady deal? 3532 03:20:42,640 --> 03:20:45,280 Now, I mean, you've said a lot of downturn tea here. 3533 03:20:45,800 --> 03:20:48,300 So, on that basis, do you accept that this looks a shady deal? 3534 03:20:48,300 --> 03:20:48,840 Final question? 3535 03:20:48,940 --> 03:20:50,400 Final question to you, Ryan. 3536 03:20:51,120 --> 03:20:56,840 Are you sorry now that you didn't stay on as an employee of RT, rather than go down the road of conduct? 3537 03:20:56,840 --> 03:20:57,960 So, we give the closing remarks... 3538 03:20:57,960 --> 03:20:59,760 I've got more to ask, but I'd like to be... 3539 03:20:59,760 --> 03:21:00,100 I appreciate it. 3540 03:21:00,100 --> 03:21:02,980 ...to our witnesses. So, who wants to go first? 3541 03:21:03,360 --> 03:21:03,580 No. 3542 03:21:04,300 --> 03:21:05,160 Okay, do you want to say a few words? 3543 03:21:05,160 --> 03:21:21,420 I... This... As Ryan said earlier on, I'll say myself, I don't do interviews. It's not what I do. That's not my job. That's what Ryan does. That's what his job is. And the fantastic people that we work with as well, and the great teams. 3544 03:21:21,880 --> 03:21:31,740 The last two and a half weeks have been absolutely horrendous. And as you said, Deputy Murphy, on family, on my children, on my business, on my name. 3545 03:21:33,400 --> 03:21:45,660 And I'm here, and we came here today, to put everything that we had. And that's exactly... We put everything... As Ryan said, when he left everything that he had on the floor, we've put everything we've had into this. We have gone through everything, everything, everything. 3546 03:21:50,980 --> 03:22:11,980 Intentional, unintentional, whatever. When the statement came out from Ortiz on the 22nd of June, and we asked them, and we had to ask... We had to get our lawyers to ask them. And this is why I kept on putting into correspondence, can you please inform us when you're sending out stuff? Can you please? And no, no, no. And it's David and Goliath. It's just, you know, it's going into a vacuum. And hopefully that will change. 3547 03:22:11,980 --> 03:22:26,520 Tubbs... Tubbs... Tubbs' democracy... Mocracy in action. Thank you very much. And Quibb. Could we... Thank you very much as well. Could we see it? Eventually saw it, asked them whether they could... Chocolate Reynolds scroll down a bit. No way. And they didn't. Var and Hadbury, thank you very much. 3548 03:22:26,980 --> 03:22:54,980 With being an agent. I'm the only... I'm the only person that the people we represent have. I am the shop steward. Where's the care... Where's the duty of care to Ryan over the last three weeks? Who reached out to see how he was? And his family. And this isn't a pity party. We're big boys. But it's been pretty horrendous. Horrendous. And I wouldn't wish it on anybody. And I thank you because we believe in the house. And that's why we've come here and we haven't talked to anybody. 3549 03:22:54,980 --> 03:23:03,220 Only yourselves. That's why we've come here. We believe in the house. And we believe in the process. And thank you for giving us the opportunity. It's really appreciated. 3550 03:23:03,520 --> 03:23:05,700 Thank you, Mr. Kelly. Mr. Tobey, any final? 3551 03:23:05,820 --> 03:23:15,360 Yeah, of course. Very briefly because... My goodness, it's time to wrap, as I say. But thanks. Just in answer to your question, Deputy Boy Barrett, about the salary situation. 3552 03:23:15,360 --> 03:23:23,660 Yeah, of course. It's all changed now, isn't it? And rightly so. And, you know, if I do go back to RTE, which I hope to, 3553 03:23:24,160 --> 03:23:30,700 it'll be a whole new world order. And that's why I said today, and I'd love to be part of the catharsis for the place. 3554 03:23:30,760 --> 03:23:37,320 Because it's a great old place. And, you know, that's why I offered today. I'd like to release, if I was to sign another contract, 3555 03:23:37,420 --> 03:23:44,620 I'd put it out to the public straight away. No messing. No three-year. Carry on. You know, I'd be part and parcel of the new process 3556 03:23:44,620 --> 03:23:51,160 to build trust with my colleagues and the listeners. No viewers anymore, but listeners anyway. So that's what I'd say to you, Vlad. 3557 03:23:51,160 --> 03:23:56,520 to you, Vlad. There's a lot of talk today about the talent in RTE. I hate being referred to as the 3558 03:23:56,520 --> 03:24:02,520 talent. I think it's an obscene, outdated word. The talent in RTE, as you know, work in the reception 3559 03:24:02,520 --> 03:24:09,120 and they work in security and in makeup and hair and sound and camera and production. That's the 3560 03:24:09,120 --> 03:24:12,680 talent. They're the people who make the programs you listen to driving into work every day and the 3561 03:24:12,680 --> 03:24:16,480 TV shows you watch at six o'clock and beyond nationwide, what have you. That's the talent. 3562 03:24:16,920 --> 03:24:21,840 So if we do anything to change the language around RTE, please take that silly word off the 3563 03:24:21,840 --> 03:24:27,380 contracts going forward. They're colleagues. No one's more is better than anyone else. I'd like to thank 3564 03:24:27,380 --> 03:24:34,260 you, Cahirlock, for your chairing of this, to the members for your robust but respectful questions 3565 03:24:34,260 --> 03:24:41,600 and your time, and for the courtesy extended to us. I'd like to particularly thank the captain of the 3566 03:24:41,600 --> 03:24:49,320 guard in Leinster House and his team, who are exceptionally decent and generous, and to the 3567 03:24:49,320 --> 03:24:53,880 catering staff, who for some weird reason I always get on really well with. You wouldn't 3568 03:24:53,880 --> 03:25:00,320 think it to look at me, but I do. And thank you for everything, and as I say, to my family, for their 3569 03:25:00,320 --> 03:25:04,880 ongoing loyalty, and to the good people of Ireland who've been kind to me in the last three weeks, 3570 03:25:04,980 --> 03:25:34,960 kindness I will never forget. Thank you. 3571 03:25:34,960 --> 03:25:37,440 The future of sports in broadcasting in Ireland. 3572 03:25:37,440 --> 03:25:40,680 It started very promisingly earlier when we came back from the break. 3573 03:25:41,000 --> 03:25:47,700 It started very promising, but unfortunately it petered out into what can only be described 3574 03:25:47,700 --> 03:25:57,340 as a damp squib. And I'm more confused now than before the day had started. I don't really 3575 03:25:57,340 --> 03:26:02,920 know what was addressed there or what the main cut and thrust or what the main sizzle points 3576 03:26:02,920 --> 03:26:11,140 were. There was some great sizzle action at four. Three to four. But here we are now, 3577 03:26:11,200 --> 03:26:16,760 twenty to seven. In fairness, they did go over time. They're into injury time. Oren, thank 3578 03:26:16,760 --> 03:26:23,960 you very much for the tip there. Tubbs, Mocracy in action. But I am flabbergasted and aghast 3579 03:26:23,960 --> 03:26:53,060 all at the same time. But we live to fight another day. Heroes aren't made in a day. Reynolds. Reynolds aren't made in a day either. Takes a long time. Takes a while. 3580 03:26:53,060 --> 03:27:19,820 To put all those parts together on a fucking production line. And that's talking about even production. What about the planning that goes into making a Renault? What about Cadbury's? What about a chocolate Renault? A Renault made out of chocolate? You think I'm talking shit? Think again. We've got one right here. 3581 03:27:19,820 --> 03:27:38,080 We've got one right here. 3582 03:27:38,080 --> 03:27:42,960 An all new 3D printed chocolate car. 3583 03:27:42,960 --> 03:27:46,400 In association with Cadbury's. 3584 03:27:46,400 --> 03:28:14,260 And Noel Kelly Management. Sponsored by Tik Tok. Proud partners with Renault and Dunstores. Featuring Aspartame and Muttman. Look at that. Sandblast. We need to play that track there again please. Maybe the entry one. 3585 03:28:14,260 --> 03:28:18,740 Oh no. I knew I'd be. 3586 03:28:28,980 --> 03:28:37,080 Well there you go. That's the signal. That's the wolf howl that signifies the end of the stream. We can get that again. 3587 03:28:39,460 --> 03:28:50,640 And I want to say thanks very much to the wee grape there. For the tip. Bring back Schlager and thank you very much. And Andy the Fork. And none other than any Shafé and Raccoon City tourism. 3588 03:28:53,480 --> 03:29:09,900 Shafé. Well. It's ready to go. Maybe just to come down after that. Maybe a bit of Shafé. And we've got one ready to go. It's a Computer Chronicles episode. It's Windows 95. Although I think we've seen this one. 3589 03:29:14,900 --> 03:29:15,800 Let me see here. 3590 03:29:22,400 --> 03:29:24,380 Guess what this show is about. 3591 03:29:24,380 --> 03:29:26,580 Yeah we have seen this. I remember that intro. 3592 03:29:28,120 --> 03:29:29,600 Guess what this show is about. 3593 03:29:44,060 --> 03:29:45,800 Actually Tom. Are you still there Tom? 3594 03:29:51,800 --> 03:29:53,320 Are we getting on? What's the story? 3595 03:29:55,040 --> 03:29:55,740 Not much. 3596 03:29:56,780 --> 03:29:59,360 We're just thinking maybe a Computer Chronicles. 3597 03:29:59,480 --> 03:30:00,880 But I have seen that one before. 3598 03:30:01,040 --> 03:30:04,180 Although I do recall you had something to show the 3599 03:30:04,180 --> 03:30:10,300 the fine collection of people who supported your quest up the mountain that day. 3600 03:30:12,460 --> 03:30:13,900 I'm glad you reminded me there. 3601 03:30:13,900 --> 03:30:18,440 I actually fell asleep during that inquest into Ryan Tubber Day and everything. 3602 03:30:18,780 --> 03:30:22,120 But I do have that clip here. 3603 03:30:22,240 --> 03:30:22,580 It was 3604 03:30:22,580 --> 03:30:25,840 the camera shut off. 3605 03:30:26,140 --> 03:30:29,340 And at the end of the stream at the top of the mountain the camera shut off. 3606 03:30:29,420 --> 03:30:31,860 But I came across an exciting cult. 3607 03:30:32,320 --> 03:30:33,680 I don't know who these people are. 3608 03:30:33,760 --> 03:30:36,020 But maybe you could shed a bit of light on it there. 3609 03:30:36,920 --> 03:30:38,360 Anybody in the chat might know. 3610 03:30:38,960 --> 03:30:40,100 If you have a clip there you have. 3611 03:30:40,100 --> 03:30:44,060 Yeah I think I have it. 3612 03:30:44,260 --> 03:30:45,180 I hope I have it. 3613 03:30:46,220 --> 03:30:46,960 Let me see here. 3614 03:30:47,680 --> 03:30:50,140 Hopefully this doesn't blow the fucking ears off anyone. 3615 03:30:51,100 --> 03:30:51,420 Good. 3616 03:30:52,280 --> 03:30:53,360 So here it is. 3617 03:30:54,680 --> 03:30:56,080 Oi you were telling me about this. 3618 03:30:56,140 --> 03:30:58,100 You came across some dudes there. 3619 03:31:05,220 --> 03:31:08,760 I came across these guys at the end of the stream on top of the mountain. 3620 03:31:09,100 --> 03:31:10,140 And I'd ended the stream. 3621 03:31:10,340 --> 03:31:14,200 But I decided to take the phone out and record them anyway. 3622 03:31:14,920 --> 03:31:17,640 I'm not particularly sure who they were or what they were about. 3623 03:31:18,140 --> 03:31:19,660 But it was fairly interesting. 3624 03:31:20,300 --> 03:31:21,260 It's a bit windy as well. 3625 03:31:21,260 --> 03:31:48,260 *Burps* 3626 03:31:48,260 --> 03:31:50,260 Crazy Bear Business. 3627 03:31:50,260 --> 03:31:54,260 Really was a crazy bit of business. 3628 03:31:54,260 --> 03:31:56,260 I never said I didn't get involved. 3629 03:31:56,260 --> 03:31:58,260 That's some craziness. 3630 03:32:02,260 --> 03:32:04,260 Great stuff, great stuff, Tom. 3631 03:32:04,260 --> 03:32:09,260 Yeah, I think we've seen that episode of Computer Chronicles, Windows 95. 3632 03:32:09,260 --> 03:32:15,260 So I think we might knock it on the head, but reconvene at some stage in the not too distant future. 3633 03:32:15,260 --> 03:32:25,260 The main thing is that a stream was had. And if anything, that's going to loosen the wheels towards putting up a new one soon enough. 3634 03:32:25,260 --> 03:32:29,260 And we're getting going back into the stream dream saddle, so to speak. 3635 03:32:29,260 --> 03:32:37,260 But I mean, to be honest now, after six and a half to seven hours of that, it's like doing a fucking full day of work having to fucking sit through one of those. 3636 03:32:37,260 --> 03:32:46,260 I really feel sorry for the people that I mean, the people that they're actually was a morning session and then a fucking afternoon session or two afternoon sessions. 3637 03:32:46,260 --> 03:32:49,260 At least the people in the first three hours got to go home. 3638 03:32:49,260 --> 03:32:51,260 We had to endure the whole thing. 3639 03:32:51,260 --> 03:32:55,260 I mean, we didn't have to, but I mean, thought it was going to be funnier than it actually was. 3640 03:32:55,260 --> 03:33:00,260 There were some nice moments, but you can't do fucking seven hours of that. 3641 03:33:00,260 --> 03:33:03,260 And I believe I'm not sure if those guys are going to be back on. 3642 03:33:03,260 --> 03:33:05,260 It's totally meant to be back on in front of anyone. 3643 03:33:05,260 --> 03:33:09,260 Is there going to be anything in the pipeline for the week ahead? 3644 03:33:09,260 --> 03:33:11,260 I actually think I'm done with that. 3645 03:33:11,260 --> 03:33:14,260 But if there's anything interesting, I will. 3646 03:33:14,260 --> 03:33:16,260 I will get back onto it. 3647 03:33:18,260 --> 03:33:19,260 All that plus farts. 3648 03:33:20,260 --> 03:33:24,260 Yes, much crack was had today Homer Thursday says scumbelina. 3649 03:33:24,260 --> 03:33:28,260 I'll have a little look on the in the the diary of broken dreams and see. 3650 03:33:29,260 --> 03:33:30,260 But. 3651 03:33:31,260 --> 03:33:36,260 Yeah, that was a look at this actually virtual meetings windows 95. 3652 03:33:37,260 --> 03:33:38,260 See, it is tempting. 3653 03:33:38,260 --> 03:33:42,260 Com deck special. 3654 03:33:42,260 --> 03:33:43,260 I think we've seen that. 3655 03:33:44,260 --> 03:33:45,260 The computer bowl. 3656 03:33:46,260 --> 03:33:47,260 I think we've seen computer art. 3657 03:33:49,260 --> 03:33:50,260 Now I'm going to leave it. 3658 03:33:50,260 --> 03:33:52,260 Don't want to don't want to push it too much. 3659 03:33:53,260 --> 03:33:56,260 I will say thank you very much to everybody who's chewed in. 3660 03:33:57,260 --> 03:34:01,260 Was a very epic quest journey through the Aractus. 3661 03:34:02,260 --> 03:34:04,260 We came, we saw, we conquered. 3662 03:34:05,260 --> 03:34:07,260 We actually got to grips with the Aractus player. 3663 03:34:07,260 --> 03:34:08,260 Still going there. 3664 03:34:08,260 --> 03:34:12,260 Powered by the O player version 2.69.1. 3665 03:34:12,260 --> 03:34:16,260 If you're interested in any of that sort of stuff. 3666 03:34:17,260 --> 03:34:18,260 It's a great player. 3667 03:34:18,260 --> 03:34:21,260 It's not the best player, but it's better than RTE player. 3668 03:34:22,260 --> 03:34:26,260 With that, a song and a leap and a prayer. 3669 03:34:27,260 --> 03:34:29,260 I want to say thank you very much. 3670 03:34:30,260 --> 03:34:31,260 Good night. 3671 03:34:31,260 --> 03:34:32,260 And we'll talk to you later on. 3672 03:34:33,260 --> 03:34:40,260 From me and everybody at Renault and Ryan Tuberty and Noel Kelly's agency. 3673 03:34:40,260 --> 03:34:42,260 I want to say thanks very much for tuning in. 3674 03:34:44,260 --> 03:34:45,260 And God bless. 3675 03:34:46,260 --> 03:34:47,260 We'll see you later. 3676 03:34:49,260 --> 03:34:50,120 All the best. 3677 03:34:50,120 --> 03:35:20,100 All the best. 3678 03:35:20,100 --> 03:35:50,080 All the best.